The Long-Winded Digestion Thread

Peata

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Jennifer said:
Peata said:
Maybe that's why an Apple cider vinegar drink or baking soda make my tummy feel better if taken around certain meals, it's neutralizing acid.

Glad your doc approves of the AC. Hope your Mom gets her issues sorted out again. I saw aloe at Walmart but I think it needs to be a certain brand, doesn't it. I have an aloe plant in my kitchen in case of burns, but the plant isn't that big - I would eat the whole thing relatively fast if I were consuming it for my diarrhea, and I would hate to destroy the plant.

Wow, that's some car. I guess a Peat car would be an Orange-mobile or Carrot-mobile.

Hmm...well, baking soda would neutralize acid by raising your pH, but the apple cider vinegar drink would actually make you more acidic. Now, if you didn't produce enough stomach acid to begin with, taking the ACV drink with meals will give you an acidic medium to help digest your foods. At least, that's how it works in RBTI.

I know Jenn mentioned getting the Aloe juice at Walmart. Umm...this brand I think:

http://www.walmart.com/ip/Fruit-Of-The- ... l/10314798

Wilfrid recommended this brand which I'll be ordering:

http://www.vitacost.com/georges-always- ... -128-fl-oz

Ha ha...yeah, a Peat car could be an orange-mobile or even a milk jug-mobile.

Funny thing is, right when we get on the highway, there's this brick building to the right that has a huge pencil sticking out of the corner of it and meanwhile I see that peanut-mobile and I thought it hysterical. I felt like I was in storyland or something. :)

I think I'll stick to the AC for now and work on my stomach acid too, where apparently I have an issue. I took some time to read up on it this evening, and I'm thinking I don't produce enough acid. I have a lot of the symptoms, such as not feeling good when I eat meat, like it's hard to digest, and having gas and bloating after meals. And stomach burning at times. Maybe the diarrhea is from that problem and if I get it corrected, I would stop having "IBS" with the diarrhea, bloat, aches, and wondering if I'm digesting half the nutrients I eat. So I think I'll start back on ACV with meals or look into Betain. Do you or anyone know about that?

Maybe this is why some people claim they look and feel younger when they use ACV - because they are finally able to get all the minerals, vitamins, protein their body needs and it stops the premature aging that occurs otherwise...

With baking soda, I get a good feeling from it when I take it between meals, say with a cup of green tea with some sugar or honey. It also makes my coffee taste smoother. And if I have baking soda in water first thing I feel like it gives me energy. But I also get the same with ACV in water in the morning, so I don't know.

I'm going to look into this low stomach acid problem more, and would appreciate any thoughts anyone has on the issue. Thanks.

Oh and Jenn, that's funny about the pencil building. Surreal, I'm sure.
 
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Jennifer

Jennifer

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Peata, this will sound strange, but if I notice bubbles (not foam) in my urine, I know I have a harder time digesting the foods I'm eating and it's creating trapped gas. I don't get gassy ever so I think it just gets trapped and my stomach bloats. It's very weird. However, I have noticed that when I take the AC at night, I wake up to a completely flat stomach so it obviously helps me with trapped air.

For me, a burning stomach always leads to diarrhea and is related to my inflamed gut, if that helps at all. I have used digestive enzymes, but not betaine/HCL. The enzymes gave me the worst indigestion. Something I never had before them. When I went to the ER for the burning stomach and vomiting, I had been on the enzymes for about 6 months. My practitioner kept having me try different ones and they all resulted in indigestion. I have a theory on supplemental enzymes/digestive aids. I feel there is probably a good reason why we have stopped producing them. They have an "breakdown substances" action in the gut and a gut that doesn't produce them naturally has probably had its "protect gut from acid" mucosal lining damaged. I feel like at that point, the gut can't tolerate all the enzymes and corrosive acids. To me, they're aggressive! But that's just my theory.

The one thing I've used with success is goldenseal. I have no clue if this is Peat approved, but when I ended up at the ER for the burning stomach, I started taking the goldenseal and within a day or two the burning was gone. It works amazingly well for healing the mucosal lining. I actually order another bottle of it when I ordered the aloe juice. One thing to note...the goldenseal needs to be cycled because it has natural antibiotic properties. I know of people who took HCL with good results, but they took it in conjunction with a berberine containing bitter like goldenseal, barberry or Oregon grape which of course builds up the mucosal lining and this probably was protective against the HCL acid.

Peata said:
With baking soda, I get a good feeling from it when I take it between meals, say with a cup of green tea with some sugar or honey. It also makes my coffee taste smoother. And if I have baking soda in water first thing I feel like it gives me energy. But I also get the same with ACV in water in the morning, so I don't know.

I'm not sure about green tea, but I know that honey will lower the pH of the baking soda. Coffee, if I remember correctly, is on the acidic side so you may still end up with a drink that's slightly acidic, but I'm not positive. Baking soda with regular water (pH around 7) would be alkaline. Since you feel energy with baking soda/water, there's a good chance you benefit from its alkalinity due to being overly acidic. Again, your issue with diarrhea makes me suspect this, but in a Peat perspective, the energy you get from the baking soda water could be from the CO2?

I still have my food list from when I did RBTI that tells what foods push our pH up or down. It's not like the standard acid/alkaline diet floating around out there. Carey A. Reams actually tested, in his own lab, hundreds of foods to see not only their properties, but how they individually changed people's pH. Of course, he checked by urine and saliva so I guess it all depends on what you believe to be accurate. I can say that when I get my urine and saliva pH down to slightly acidic (6.4 - 6.8) my digestion becomes quite regular, thus why I use the apple cider vinegar/honey drink if my pH gets too high. Luckily, the coconut oil and coffee got things moving again. :) I'm going to try peatarian's advice on AC dosing so I may have to take the ACV/honey drink if the AC drives my pH up again.
 

sunmountain

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Hi Jenn and Peata, I'm reading your posts with interest. I'm having diarrhea again constantly. That means little is getting digested. It takes 4+ hours to make RPPS including waiting for starch to settle, and minutes for it to leave my body. Today was day 3 of RPPS. I don't have time or energy to make another batch for tomorrow.

Still waiting for test results.

I can't find peatarian's advice on AC. Could someone please post that link?

Thanks
 

Peata

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sunmountain said:
Hi Jenn and Peata, I'm reading your posts with interest. I'm having diarrhea again constantly. That means little is getting digested. It takes 4+ hours to make RPPS including waiting for starch to settle, and minutes for it to leave my body. Today was day 3 of RPPS. I don't have time or energy to make another batch for tomorrow.

Still waiting for test results.

I can't find peatarian's advice on AC. Could someone please post that link?

Thanks

Sorry you're going through this too, SM. I had a bout of rip-roarin' diarrhea this evening after dinner. :( Back to sipping on Gatorade, even though I'm sure it's terrible Peat-wise, but it's convenient. I guess it's partly my fault because I went too long between meals and was really shaky and felt terrible by the time I ate so I scarfed it down, and it was a mix of foods that probably didn't play well in my tummy. But darn, I really paid for it. I'm going to come in a little lower on protein today than I'd like (80+ grams today but lately I try to get at least 100), but then again I probably lost the whole dinner's worth of nutrition in the bathroom this evening. :( Sorry for the TMI but I feel this is one thread where we can just let it all hang out since it's about all our digestion problems.
 

tara

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sunmountain said:
Hi Jenn and Peata, I'm reading your posts with interest. I'm having diarrhea again constantly. That means little is getting digested. It takes 4+ hours to make RPPS including waiting for starch to settle, and minutes for it to leave my body. Today was day 3 of RPPS. I don't have time or energy to make another batch for tomorrow.

Still waiting for test results.

I can't find peatarian's advice on AC. Could someone please post that link?

Thanks

I wonder if stewed apples or just the liquid from stewed apples would help against diarhhea?

Peatarian on AC:
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=226&p=1715&hilit=+activated+charcoal#p1715
 

Peata

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Jennifer said:
Peata, this will sound strange, but if I notice bubbles (not foam) in my urine, I know I have a harder time digesting the foods I'm eating and it's creating trapped gas. I don't get gassy ever so I think it just gets trapped and my stomach bloats. It's very weird. However, I have noticed that when I take the AC at night, I wake up to a completely flat stomach so it obviously helps me with trapped air.

For me, a burning stomach always leads to diarrhea and is related to my inflamed gut, if that helps at all. I have used digestive enzymes, but not betaine/HCL. The enzymes gave me the worst indigestion. Something I never had before them. When I went to the ER for the burning stomach and vomiting, I had been on the enzymes for about 6 months. My practitioner kept having me try different ones and they all resulted in indigestion. I have a theory on supplemental enzymes/digestive aids. I feel there is probably a good reason why we have stopped producing them. They have an "breakdown substances" action in the gut and a gut that doesn't produce them naturally has probably had its "protect gut from acid" mucosal lining damaged. I feel like at that point, the gut can't tolerate all the enzymes and corrosive acids. To me, they're aggressive! But that's just my theory.

The one thing I've used with success is goldenseal. I have no clue if this is Peat approved, but when I ended up at the ER for the burning stomach, I started taking the goldenseal and within a day or two the burning was gone. It works amazingly well for healing the mucosal lining. I actually order another bottle of it when I ordered the aloe juice. One thing to note...the goldenseal needs to be cycled because it has natural antibiotic properties. I know of people who took HCL with good results, but they took it in conjunction with a berberine containing bitter like goldenseal, barberry or Oregon grape which of course builds up the mucosal lining and this probably was protective against the HCL acid.

Peata said:
With baking soda, I get a good feeling from it when I take it between meals, say with a cup of green tea with some sugar or honey. It also makes my coffee taste smoother. And if I have baking soda in water first thing I feel like it gives me energy. But I also get the same with ACV in water in the morning, so I don't know.

I'm not sure about green tea, but I know that honey will lower the pH of the baking soda. Coffee, if I remember correctly, is on the acidic side so you may still end up with a drink that's slightly acidic, but I'm not positive. Baking soda with regular water (pH around 7) would be alkaline. Since you feel energy with baking soda/water, there's a good chance you benefit from its alkalinity due to being overly acidic. Again, your issue with diarrhea makes me suspect this, but in a Peat perspective, the energy you get from the baking soda water could be from the CO2?

I still have my food list from when I did RBTI that tells what foods push our pH up or down. It's not like the standard acid/alkaline diet floating around out there. Carey A. Reams actually tested, in his own lab, hundreds of foods to see not only their properties, but how they individually changed people's pH. Of course, he checked by urine and saliva so I guess it all depends on what you believe to be accurate. I can say that when I get my urine and saliva pH down to slightly acidic (6.4 - 6.8) my digestion becomes quite regular, thus why I use the apple cider vinegar/honey drink if my pH gets too high. Luckily, the coconut oil and coffee got things moving again. :) I'm going to try peatarian's advice on AC dosing so I may have to take the ACV/honey drink if the AC drives my pH up again.

Thanks for taking the time to write all that, it gives me a lot to think about. I too feel like the AC has helped with bloating. My stomach has looked less pregnant ever since I started taking it regularly last week. So that's some improvement.

You're not the only one I've heard say that digestive supplements made things worse. Your theory makes sense to me. I think I'll skip the Betaine for now. I will work more with the ACV drink. I know Peat doesn't like fermented stuff and lactic acid but does make allowance for some vinegar in the carrot salad. But I wonder what he'd say about using ACV a few times a day for digestive purposes, at least til things get fixed (hopefully they would). I'm talking anywhere from 1 t. to 1 T at a time in water with some sugar or honey. The vinegar is acetic acid, which is a part of aspirin, after all.

Goldenseal, that sounds familiar like an herbalist had me take that for immunity or something but that was ages ago so I don't remember. I'll read up on it when I get through all these other open tabs I have... so much reading no wonder I can't keep half of it straight in my head, it's info overload. But goldenseal will be another thing to keep in the bag of tricks (such as aloe, the glutamine supplement, etc.) possibly if other things don't work. :carrot Glad you and others are around to offer this help.

I get confused on the alkaline/acid foods, but if you take an acidic drink such as ACV or lemon, it's supposed to alkalanize, isn't it.
 

sunmountain

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I need to start stocking gatorade too. Or Emergen-C...isn't that also an electrolyte mix? I just took about 5.5g of AC since I know it will stop me up. I need to order bulk AC so I can do it regularly.

I haven't done cronometer since going on RPPS cuz like what's the point...I knew I was way undereating since it is an elimination diet. I'm going back to regular food tomorrow and begin crono again cuz I don't want to undereat. Even if it doesn't get digested.

I think it was drinking milk regularly 2 cups a day that altered my gut flora, causing the extreme bloat. Until then I was only slightly bloated, and sometimes not at all.

But I don't think that just laying off milk -- which I've done -- will solve the inflammation now. I think I need a circuit breaker now...

Thanks for the link, Tara! Since stewed apples sound delish, I will make them tomorrow, as I have none at home just now.
 

Peata

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I've laid off the milk too for the last week. I still have some dairy like I always used to, but I have suspected the milk for a while as causing me problems. I think stopping the milk has helped with the bloat, along with taking the AC.

I took 1 mg. Cyproheptadine tonight. I'm reading on it, but isn't it supposed to help with these issues some?
 

tara

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Peata said:
I took 1 mg. Cyproheptadine tonight. I'm reading on it, but isn't it supposed to help with these issues some?
Antihistamine and antiserotonin. I think Haidut may have had a study on other benefits to GI. Could help against diarhhea. I've just used it a few times. Didn't have diarhhea, and seem to now have slowed peristalsis.
I know what you mean about information overload.
 

sunmountain

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Just ordered a pound of AC. Read an interesting way to eat AC by a customer on that site -- she said it mixes well with applesauce and her kids love it that way, and they eat it regularly.

I'll try mixing it with applesauce too when I get it.

After reading Peatarian's and other threads on AC, it seems it's fine to take it regularly in pretty much whatever quantity.

And VoS thinks some CO along with it is good.

My doc said AC detoxes the liver!

Re Cypro, I've been taking it for a while now for insomnia, and it usually works well. I take 4mg at bed. I'm wondering if taking larger quantities will help the gut. BUT it decreases histamine and serotinin, but not the CAUSE of the histamine and sertonin -- the endotoxin. So could be a good complement to AC? -- just not at the same time.
 

tara

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I found it pretty easy to get the AC down by mixing the powder with water in a bottle, shaking very vigourously and then just drinking it. You don't want to breathe the powder. The taste is very mild. If you take it with the apple sauce, you are likely to lose some of the benefit of both. You'd probably still get some of the benefit, though, so if you can't face just taking the AC by itself I expect it would still be better than nothing. I would take the CO on the same day, but again, and hour or two away from the AC for similar reasons.
Good to have your doc's approval:):
 

SQu

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Wow this thread moves along fast! Peata I'm not sure what helped with the bloated feeling but it might have been thyroid.
VoS I'm pretty desperate for a breakthrough, something is holding me back and I think it's fundamental and everything else I do (even thyroid) is treating symptoms constantly generated by this. I'm a little concerned about weight gain with the CO though. Just can't get even bigger. Mostly carrying it on the midriff. Cortisol still raging. Thanks for the feedback.
 
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Jennifer

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Peata said:
I get confused on the alkaline/acid foods, but if you take an acidic drink such as ACV or lemon, it's supposed to alkalanize, isn't it.

Well, I think I will only confuse you more since I'm looking at pH/acidity/alkalinity through an RBTI lens which is very different then the standard acid/alkaline diet out there. RBTI is based on ionization/energy. So foods are categorized as anionic or cationic. The link below will explain it better if your interested, but the cliff note version...lemons drive my pH up and the apple cider vinegar/honey drink drives my pH down and with that my digestion speeds up.

http://www.brixman.com/acidalkaline.html

Does anyone know Ray's view on raw vs. pasteurized milk in terms of digestibility? I thought it was mentioned that he viewed pasteurized milk as being easier to digest than raw, but this is opposite from a WAPF view and I want to make sure I'm remembering correctly.

I had been drinking raw milk ever since I got hurt and I seemed to digest it much easier than pasteurized, but I was dealing with the rash at the time and I don't want to make things worse if the bacteria or the enzymes in raw were only adding to the issue. I just remember that the raw milk didn't bind me up or cause a stuffy nose or sore throat. My sore throat is going full force again and I think I remember reading (could of been a peatarian comment) that it indicates high serotonin? I can get amazing tasting 100% grass-fed raw straight from the farm or mostly grass-fed raw at the store so I'm keeping my fingers crossed that I can drink it without getting the rash.

Sunmountain, sorry to hear about the diarrhea still persisting despite doing RPPS diet. I can't remember if you've mentioned this anywhere, but when did you first start having issues with the diarrhea? Do you remember the first foods to trigger it?
 

Peata

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sunmountain said:
My doc said AC detoxes the liver!

Re Cypro, I've been taking it for a while now for insomnia, and it usually works well. I take 4mg at bed. I'm wondering if taking larger quantities will help the gut. BUT it decreases histamine and serotinin, but not the CAUSE of the histamine and sertonin -- the endotoxin. So could be a good complement to AC? -- just not at the same time.

Good to know another doc likes AC.

Re Cypro, I took 1 mg. last night and was groggy this a.m., and still don't quite feel like myself. I get the same effect from Benadryl and Hydroxzine, but this is even longer last, so if I take it again tonight I'll do .5 mg.

I still had diarrhea 2 x already today.

I'm back on ACV drink especially around heavy meals or ones I think might require more digestive power.

I also take 4 charcoal capsules at a time a few x day. I definitely have less bloat now, and I attribute it to AC and removing milk from my daily diet. I still have dairy as I mentioned before - cream or h/h in coffee, some cheese, etc. but as far as just drinking cups of milk? No.
 

Peata

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Jennifer said:
Peata said:
I get confused on the alkaline/acid foods, but if you take an acidic drink such as ACV or lemon, it's supposed to alkalanize, isn't it.

Well, I think I will only confuse you more since I'm looking at pH/acidity/alkalinity through an RBTI lens which is very different then the standard acid/alkaline diet out there. RBTI is based on ionization/energy. So foods are categorized as anionic or cationic. The link below will explain it better if your interested, but the cliff note version...lemons drive my pH up and the apple cider vinegar/honey drink drives my pH down and with that my digestion speeds up.

http://www.brixman.com/acidalkaline.html

So is acidity the state that causes diarrhea and alkaline is constipation?

And if so, does ACV contribute to diarrhea and lemon juice to stopping it?

Or I wonder if baking soda drink is the better choice.

Or just use charcoal.

You're right, I'm more confused :?: , but I am just trying to figure out what to do. My goal is this: digest certain foods better (such as meat and fat) thereby using nutrients better, stop bloating, and help stop diarrhea which will also help me retain my nutrients.
 
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Peata said:
...My goal is this: digest certain foods better (such as meat and fat) thereby using nutrients better, stop bloating, and help stop diarrhea which will also help me retain my nutrients.


My opinion is that if you don't feel you are digesting meat and fat very well that indicates you have LOW stomach acid, baking soda will make it worse. Plain apple cider vinegar taken in a small amount of water just before a meal will definitely help. Also Betaine HCL can also help digest protein, however these are just temporary measures. Incompletely digested food will cause bloating and diarrhea.

The most important thing to do is raise your metabolism with thyroid meds. Kill off the problematic gut flora and mop up the endotoxin with activated charcoal. Some people also need more salt and iodine to make adequate stomach acid. Eating enough seafood?
 

Peata

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thebigpeatowski said:
Peata said:
...My goal is this: digest certain foods better (such as meat and fat) thereby using nutrients better, stop bloating, and help stop diarrhea which will also help me retain my nutrients.

My opinion is that if you don't feel you are digesting meat and fat very well that indicates you have LOW stomach acid, baking soda will make it worse. Plain apple cider vinegar taken in a small amount of water just before a meal will definitely help. Also Betaine HCL can also help digest protein, however these are just temporary measures. Incompletely digested food will cause bloating and diarrhea.

The most important thing to do is raise your metabolism with thyroid meds. Kill off the problematic gut flora and mop up the endotoxin with activated charcoal. Some people also need more salt and iodine to make adequate stomach acid. Eating enough seafood?

Thanks, BP. I'll keep up with the AC. I need to order a bulk amount so I can save money and not have to pop so many capsules.

I salt my food to taste and probably use more than I did pre-Peat. Perhaps my use of baking soda for a while was giving me more salt and could be another reason I felt better along with the added CO2 it gave me.

But I have cut back on the baking soda since I think I may have low stomach acid. Maybe I can still enjoy it between meals?

I don't eat that much seafood because I'm not sure of the quality of the frozen shrimp in the stores. I do like the oysters I get from the deli case packed in a plastic tub of liquid. They say there are Pacific, which I know has it's own problems but they really taste good to me when I cook them. I get them once per week.

Also adding that I cut out milk. I still have dairy from cream or h/h in coffee, some cheese, a little milk for cooking, etc. but I feel better since I don't drink cups of it anymore. I only have access to supermarket milk, btw. I still have bouts of diarrhea as I so often have most of my adult life, but at least the bloating is much less, along with AC helping me.
 
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I do think the baking soda might be better between meals if you don't feel like you are digesting meat well. Some Betaine HCL supps also have additional digestive enzymes for helping with fat digestion. I think Peat says that problems with dairy indicate intestinal imbalance, which is stating the obvious here. Getting enough selenium is important for thyroid too.

It's good to hear that the bloating is going down, swollen guts release more serotonin....a vicious circle indeed. Poor digestion is really hard on the liver too making estrogen removal tough.

I am really enjoying the large doses of AC once or twice a week at night, keeps tummy flat and mood very stable.
 

Peata

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thebigpeatowski said:
I do think the baking soda might be better between meals if you don't feel like you are digesting meat well. Some Betaine HCL supps also have additional digestive enzymes for helping with fat digestion. I think Peat says that problems with dairy indicate intestinal imbalance, which is stating the obvious here. Getting enough selenium is important for thyroid too.

It's good to hear that the bloating is going down, swollen guts release more serotonin....a vicious circle indeed. Poor digestion is really hard on the liver too making estrogen removal tough.

I am really enjoying the large doses of AC once or twice a week at night, keeps tummy flat and mood very stable.

I see that oysters are highest in selenium after brazil nuts. Maybe I should have the oysters twice per week. I do think I feel better overall after I eat them. I like the "fresh" ones I mentioned better than the canned. I wanted them again yesterday (last had them on Thursday) so maybe my body is telling me something.

I'm so happy the bloat has gone down. I still have a soft, doughy belly from being overweight, but I feel like my metabolism is perking a little better since I cut the milk and use the charcoal. And I feel like weight loss is possible now.

So my plan so far: keep up the AC, use ACV drink before heavy meals, oysters 2x week, keep up the exercise, getting good sleep, dairy intake where I have it now, salt intake same, baking soda between meals or do more bag breathing, keep protein 100+ mg.

Any other suggestions anyone? I think the only thing I'm missing is killing bad flora. The AC just mops up the endotoxin, not balance bactera, right? Did I read right that it's bad flora causing the diarrhea? Last week when I used larger amounts of AC, I did stop the diarrhea and tended toward constipation but I wasn't using a lot of CO at the time either, which might have balanced the effect. Thoughts welcome.
 

HDD

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Peata, do you have Trader Joe's in your area? They carry a frozen wild shrimp for $8-$9 a lb. Crab meat and scallops also contain selenium. I plan on making a quiche with the canned crabmeat. I get the Patagonian scallops at my local grocery store.

Are you supplementing calcium since you are lowering your dairy?
 

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