Optimal Sodium Intake Is At Least 230% Higher Than RDA

haidut

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Finally, some sanity is coming out of popular science. This latest study shows that some people can lose up to 30g of sodium a day and this can wreak havoc on their calcium and magnesium levels, just like Ray said. What is interesting is that the borderline (i.e. minimally acceptable) levels of sodium intake for keeping calcium and magnesium level are much higher than the FDA published RDA. Basically, you need at least 63mg/kg of body weight daily sodium intake to prevent the chronic loss of calcium and magnesium. I attached one of the images from the study for reference.
Also, anything below that intake will increase (not decrease) water retention, again, just like Ray said. Finally, one of the main factors in determining sodium retention are carbon dioxide levels. So, Ray's quote that hypothyroidism can be simply defined as the chronic loss of sodium and carbon dioxide appears to be on solid grounds.
For those looking or specific recommendations, since salt is about 40% sodium, you need 10g-15g of salt daily to meet the requirements of the study. If you use sodium bicarbonate, it is about 27% sodium so that equates to 20g-22g daily intake of baking soda to meet the requirements. Interestingly enough, ingesting 20g-22g of sodium bicarbonate a day is what is typically used in studies showing ergogenic (performance) benefit for athletes.
Keep in mind this assumes that you get your sodium only from those sources. Since most people ingest sodium through the various foods they eat during the day, in reality you can lower the above listed intakes, but even if you ingest 61mg/kg of supplemental sodium in top of what you already eat, it should not be a problem as Ray has said that higher sodium intake can only do good.
A very interesting read that I recommend everyone should familiarize themselves with if they ever had any fear of salt/sodium.

http://suppversity.blogspot.com/2014/10 ... d-for.html
 

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Underlying the cholesterol, salt and sugar phobias is the "necessary but harmful" concept, and many people extract this concept from those biological beliefs as an excuse to be nihilistic, when in reality the concept is what's making them buy into the phobia in the first place.
 

chris

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Thank you for this haidut, I was recently wondering the optimal amount of salt. I'm going to start drinking 2 x 1tsp salt water a day and see if it improves anything.
 

SaltGirl

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Isn't the much higher intake(62mg/kg) relevant to those who exercise/sweat, though?

What would be interesting to know is if people's food preferences tend to be affected by low sodium. I sometimes get these huge cravings for a pizza with lots of cheese and pepperoni, and those cravings tend to subside if I ensure I get enough sodium.
 

jyb

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SaltGirl said:
What would be interesting to know is if people's food preferences tend to be affected by low sodium.

From my experience, I would say it's hardly affected by high sodium, at least. After some teaspoons of salt daily, I don't think I find salty foods less attractive. In 2+ years of medium or high salt, only once did I get a craving for water or liquid, and maybe that was a sign of excess sodium.
 

pboy

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this is making me wonder whats up with me...cause I gotta keep salt low (adequate but pretty low) or my whole flow slows down...urinate less, and slower, and slowly start retaining water. Im thinking I get a gram a day total. Based on what everyone here says it seems something that only happens to me
 

superhuman

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pboy: have you tried using sodium bicarbonade/baking soda instead? same is happening to me if i use regular salt in high amounts
 

Suikerbuik

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I usually get signs of water retention after 20g/day. I take about at least 12-15 g/day of salt and 3g bicarbonate to offset the chloride. But be careful with bicarbonate. Alkaline pH of urine can have negative effects. I prefer an average urine pH that is slightly acidic.
 

pboy

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superhuman, no I haven't...interesting, maybe its just the chloride fraction that becomes the burden. Ill keep that in mind next time im adding any...see how it affects
 

SaltGirl

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I have discovered for myself that if I am eating a lot of sodium I need to drink much more water than usual even though I don't feel much worse. I find myself feeling much better overall and so on.
 

pboy

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I think desalination is an energy requiring process also...perhaps because I keep myself to just as much calories as I need, I have to do the same with salt...cause it takes energy to actually desalinate blood...I dunno, ill keep my senses open, but so far extra salt hasn't been anything but a burden for me. Its even a slight sedative...and I like to be peak energy
 

superhuman

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pboy: yes RP told me that some people react to chloride. I can smash down unlimited sodium bicarb without getting water retention or anything. If i do it with salt i blow up like a baloon
 

pboy

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nice to know man, im thinking my kidneys might not be optimal for some reason too...way back when I used to stress them a lot. I also never sweat, so that probably puts more tension on kidney to remove. I actually feel a bit lighter in general since reducing salt, but perhaps baking soda might help, though I have no real craving or desire for it atm, which maybe indicates im not deficient
 

Mittir

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@pboy

I think you can optimize your salt retention by keeping your estrogen level
low. Raw carrot salad or cooked bamboo shoot can lower endotxin burden
on liver and that will keep estrogen in check. Estrogen inhibit production
of albumin, which bind both water and sodium. You can check your serum
albumin level to see where it is. Adequate protein intake is also required to
keep albumin level up. I am quite sensitive to salt intake. I compensate that
by high intake of calcium and potassium from milk, coffee, juice etc.
My magnesium intake around 350 mg. Good thyroid function also lowers
estrogen and retain sodium. I use a lot of baking soda to apple juice now and that
is the major source of sodium now. You can also take a lot of regular salt
with cheese,potato and sour fruits without feeling bad.
 

pboy

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really appreciate that man, I actually thought maybe biliary backup (estrogen, other glucuronic acid combined breakdown products) might have been the problem, because ive been without carrot or other fiber for a while...I ate a large sweet potato last night, it was probably a good 16 grams fiber alone. This morning after elimination I felt significantly better, more doped up and energized. It very well could be liver backup...my protein is low but im good at sensing cravings, and haven't had any for protein...so that makes me thing probably ive gone too long recycling bile...points to its importance of some soluble fiber I suppose, a couple times a week im thinking at the least

when I was eating vegan diet a while back, really low protein, I got too low in albumin and similar sensitivities to water and salt came up, but id always crave proteinacous foods (back then I was having enough regular fiber to remove bile toxins). I didn't know estrogen reduced albumin synthesis, but that could be something I need to keep in mind
 

Mittir

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pboy said:
my protein is low but im good at sensing cravings, and haven't had any for protein...so that makes me thing probably ive gone too long recycling bile.

RP has mentioned that our body has a very good internal system of craving for
what it needs, especially for sugar and salt. But, it is not strong for protein.
I think it is probably because we are already a huge mass of protein and body
does not see need of protein as emergency.

I am bit tired of eating raw carrot salad everyday, i was looking for a substitute
and asked RP about coconut fiber. He think gas is the only problem from mature coconut
meat. Sometime i just eat fruits like raw guava or apple with coconut oil. It works well.
 

pboy

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nice, im actually allergic to coconut I think cause I get red dry face, even break out...but really ripe inner fruit fiber(mostly melon..non harsh acidic or pectin fruits) or well cooked inner tuber fiber seems to be extremely gentle and effective. Im thinking im gonna up milk a bit to add more protein by ratio
 

Blossom

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prototype said:
I upped salt to 12g/day now. Feel a lot better.
Did you gradually build up to this amount and if so could you share your approach? :D
 

pboy

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see this is where 'better' is subjective. Such high sodium is a sedative and mind quieter, but it really reduces higher mind functioning and awareness...ability to sense things, quite profoundly. You have to eat low salt long enough to realize this. Its like saying a pain killer or cough medicine makes you 'feel better'. I guess what im going for is different, I suppose this is why the recommendation is salt to taste so we can adjust to our preferences depending on the outcome we each want
 

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