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Pansterone - Liquid Pregnenolone/DHEA Mix
- Thread starter haidut
- Start date
OP
Maxen93 said:
We are back to using the DMSO version.
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ThunderSpank
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- Nov 6, 2015
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- 87
haidut said:
Ray recommended pregnenolone for me for my heart palpitations and its working pretty well, do you think if I'm taking 50mg of pregnenolone in the morning and at night that taking Pansterone at lunch would be OK? I was worried about Pansterone stopping the Pregnenolone that I take from turning into DHEA. I'm a 25 year old male and dont want my androgens inhibited. Thank you very much!
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OP
ThunderSpank said:
Pansterone already contains DHEA, so don't think low DHEA is an issue here. Applied topically, the pregnenolone seems to convert mostly into progesterone and androstenedione, so at least some of the pregnenolone feeds into the androgen pathways on top of whatever the DHEA will convert into. Just my 2c.
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Where's the DHEA in Pansterone derived from? Time ago I read on the subject about taking a bit of DHEA for regulating endogenous decline -I still didnt labs yet to see- and i found a product claiming "bio-identical" hormone called "Twist 25 DHEA".
On another site, I read this, warning about wild yams extract sources:
Commercial DHEA products are made from diosgenin, an extract from the Mexican wild yam of the Dioscorea family. Biochemists can convert diosgenin to DHEA by engineering a series of chemical conversions.
The market is flooded with encapsulated yam products claiming to be "DHEA precursors" or "natural DHEA." Unfortunately, the human body--or any living system, for that matter--cannot convert diosgenin to DHEA. It happens only in the laboratory.
The ingestion of Dioscorea plant extracts can't possibly lead to the formation of DHEA in the body, according to prominent DHEA expert Seymour Lieberman, Ph.D., of St. Luke's - Roosevelt Hospital Center in New York City. Products containing Mexican yam or unconverted diosgenin may produce other beneficial hormonal effects, but they will not raise DHEA levels.
The research studies revealing DHEA's therapeutic effects were all done with real hormone, not yam extracts. Read labels and insist on 99 percent pharmacologically pure DHEA.
http://www.anti-agingmd.com/dhea.html
On another site, I read this, warning about wild yams extract sources:
Commercial DHEA products are made from diosgenin, an extract from the Mexican wild yam of the Dioscorea family. Biochemists can convert diosgenin to DHEA by engineering a series of chemical conversions.
The market is flooded with encapsulated yam products claiming to be "DHEA precursors" or "natural DHEA." Unfortunately, the human body--or any living system, for that matter--cannot convert diosgenin to DHEA. It happens only in the laboratory.
The ingestion of Dioscorea plant extracts can't possibly lead to the formation of DHEA in the body, according to prominent DHEA expert Seymour Lieberman, Ph.D., of St. Luke's - Roosevelt Hospital Center in New York City. Products containing Mexican yam or unconverted diosgenin may produce other beneficial hormonal effects, but they will not raise DHEA levels.
The research studies revealing DHEA's therapeutic effects were all done with real hormone, not yam extracts. Read labels and insist on 99 percent pharmacologically pure DHEA.
http://www.anti-agingmd.com/dhea.html
OP
Agent207 said:
How may times is this going to come up on the forum?? Did you search before posting this? Yes, most of the commercially sold pregnenolone, progesterone, and DHEA probably come from wild yam. But as even the quote in your post says, the yam extract has been fully reacted/converted and the results are the actual hormones and are bioidentical to the ones you produce. So, I am not using or selling anything that is a "DHEA precursor" or "pregnenolone precursor", etc. The substances in Pansterone are actual hormones. I gave Charlie and Dan Wich the CoA that I have from the manufacturer. Legally, a chemical company like Sigma-Aldrich cannot sell a "precursor" and claim that it is the actual hormone. And if you don't believe those, use Pansterone for a month and go do a blood hormone test.
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Vinero
Member
Do you see any issues with combining progest-E with pansterone? Progest-E has really positive effects on me but the only negative is the libido-lowering effect, I like to 'cure' this problem of progest-E with pansterone. Since topical DHEA is so effective at raising androgens including DHT.
OP
Vinero said:
I think the combination would be synergistic actually. I'd use doses of Pansterone equal to progesterone. So, if you are taking 10mg progesterone daily I would use 2 doses of Pansterone giving 10mg pregnenolone and 10mg DHEA.
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OP
Agent207 said:
I suggest you read the original post as this is explained in the study I quoted extensively. In combinations, pregnenolone and DHEA can have an overstimulating effect. Also, DHEA blocks the conversion of pregnenolone into anything other then progesterone -> aldosterone pathway. So, taking too much pregnenolone with DHEA can increase blood pressure. Finally, the goal of the supplement is to have a balanced androgenic/progestogenic effect and not sway the balance too much in one direction. Too much pregnenolone and you get anti-libido effects, and too much DHEA and you get estrogenic effects. I have posted extensively on this, both the DHEA and pregnenolone doses in Pansterone are based on tens of studies looking at giving too much, too little, and trying to find out what is optimal. Pansterone seems (so far) to be optimal in the sense that it gives men pumped up muscles and libido, and does not make women grow a mustache (even though it is Movember
).
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Thanks for that clear and detailed insight. I hope to get in a matter of weeks a complete blood test done on sex hormones, adrenal and thyroid to figure out how things are doing right now -apparently fine although my tsh is 3.4 so I need to know more numbers- and Im sure, along wth some ndt probably, this product will fit me very well.
OP
gp3690 said:
That is awesome! Thanks for sharing. It's interesting that even a single dose can bring about these effects. I was worried initially that DHEA below 10mg daily would not have much of an effect.
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johnwester130
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- Aug 6, 2015
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- 3,563
What about a DHT product , for people who want to increase DHT ?
http://www.dhtcream.com/andractim/ - would this work ?
http://www.dhtcream.com/andractim/ - would this work ?
OP
johnwester130 said:
It just happens to be illegal to sell in the USA and most of the other countries without a pharma license, tracking by the DEA, and official prescription by an endocrinologist. If I had legal rights to sell DHT I would have been all over it already.
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cantstoppeating
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- Nov 11, 2014
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haidut said:
For me a single dose is too much. I get a noticeable effect from 1-2 drops: I feel a rush-like sensation where my hands turn slightly pink. If I take it in the afternoon, I have to keep a fan near my bed so that I don't get too hot and drench my sheets with sweat during the night. When I take half of a single dose, or a single dose, I get a bloodsugar crash similar to when I take too much B2 or biotin or pregnenolone.
And I can definitely attest to the muscle "pump" feeling; it's like doing resistance training while taking creatine -- a rush of blood gorges the muscle and makes it feel as though it's going to explode. It's not as extreme but certainly noticeable.
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Such_Saturation
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cantstoppeating said:
How is your hairline doing
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cantstoppeating
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Such_Saturation said:
No noticeable difference.
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haidut said:
Hey Haidut in one of your recent talks with Danny Roddy you said that LDL was the good cholesterol, is this something you've changed your stance on recently or was the "(bad)" just left in from pasting the quote?
Also when testosterone gels are applied to the scrotum it has a higher conversion rate to DHT, would this apply to DHEA even though it is further up in the chain?
Cheers, great work btw.
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