An Almost Fat Free, Starch Free Experiment

A summary: for the past 6 days I've been experimenting with trying to remove fat and starch almost entirely from my diet. The aim is to adapt a weight loss plan that works for me, unlike all the rest.
Today for the first time I put the usual day's intake into cronometer and got this (I'm looking for themes, things to address to personalize this approach to work for me, see why it's not at the moment):

gelatin
3 boiled eggs
600ml fat free milk
tub fat free cottage cheese
1 skinless chicken breast
5 dark roast coffee
a cup of sugar or more
6 nectarines

Very restricted I know. It's just a start.

2100 calories
137g protein (27%)
347g carb (62%)
26g fat (11%) not counting the bamboo shoots with about a teaspoon max of olive oil

Levels: a bit to very low in folate, C, E, K - E not so much
minerals - bit low in magnesium and potassium, lower in manganese, it says also sodium but I'm not counting salting food to taste
calcium:phosphorus is not good - 1262:1926 but I am having less milk than before due to trying not to overdo liquids

So now I have a few reasons why I'm not feeling good and don't feel like I'm losing weight either other than day one when I peed a lot. I feel unsatisfied, get ravenously hungry again quickly (hello there hunger, I thought you'd gone for good!), feel antsy, restless and craving in a general unspecific way.

This evening I mixed a teaspoon of coconut oil into the chicken breast and so far that's feeling good.
I am reluctant to add greens for the folate and minerals because I just don't want them. Ever! Prefer fruit. I could make a broth but that would be more liquid and I already know it's held me back, too much liquid.
Milk: Combining milk intake with coffee would solve the calcium phosphorus problem but now that I'm making French press style, it's messy and doesn't work to replace the water with milk. But tomorrow I'll do half and half, see how that goes.

I'm talking thyroid as usual, B1 and 3 as usual, aspirin as usual, cypro. In spite of this, constipation worse, so more hypo.

Re: An almost fatt free, starch free experiment

I was using the French press to make milk coffee, but I just couldn't get through it. Too thick! I ended up using it to make low fat coffee ice cream. I am down to two cups of coffee a day and supplementing with caffeine pills. Same reason: can't seem to clear the fluids. I hope this improves for us both. I'm hoping once I get rid of the excess fluids I have now, my body will be able to keep up and I'll be able to drink a little more.
I don't really care for boiled eggs. So my thought was nix a couple of eggs and use a little more coconut oil for metabolic value. Also, I am another strained yogurt fan. High calcium high protein. That way if I don't drink all of my quart of milk allotment I'm OK.

Maybe you could try eggshell powder to improve the calcium:phosphorus ratio? I notice a difference when phosphorus comes in higher than calcium. I just feel kinda 'off' and don't sleep as well as I normally would.

Hmm...I just use a 2 liter mason jar to make a cold-brew concentrate and add the bare minimum of water to keep the coffee as concentrated as possible and let it steep in the water for 24 hours. I then add a couple tablespoons of the "liquid" coffee concentrate to a full glass of milk.

When you say that you were using a French press to make coffee milk, were you replacing the water with milk in the French press, Peatri Dish? I'm just curious how it was too thick. I've never managed to get a cold-brew concentrate that was thick.

Re: A fat free, starch free experiment

Yes. I heated the milk and then put it in the jar and pressed the coffee through. The first cup was pretty tasty, but it got a sort of sweet, thick, too much thing going as it cooled down. I also added sugar and gelatin.

Re: A fat free, starch free experiment

26g fat on a day is not fat free at ALL. If your really going fat free then 10g is max a day. Please dont start this missleading topic and your breakfast consists of 3 eggs and you say you are going fat free.
*shaking head*

Re: A fat free, starch free experiment

Any particular reason you are consuming about a cup of sugar instead of more fruit? You're missing out on a lot of nutrients (and taste).

Re: A fat free, starch free experiment

Fyi: Super concentrated coffee:
http://www.funraniumlabs.com/the-black- ... -vs-coffee

Re: A fat free, starch free experiment

Thanks for all the great feedback and suggestions. Fruit that's acceptably ripe at the moment is nectarines and watermelon. I'm cooking the nectarines if they seem not fully ripened, with sugar, and making a jelly with them. It's a good way to combine sugar and protein. I was juicing watermelons but I'm a bit tired of them.
Eggshell is a good idea, thanks!
I read the link, Philomath, thanks. Jennifer that sounds like it would work. Do you just - what - cover the coffee with water and leave it?
I will see if there's a thread on cold press coffee.

Re: A fat free, starch free experiment

More fruit, milk/eggshell and coffee should get levels up on magnesium, potassium, Vit C and calcium. That leaves manganese, folate, Vit E and K.
E I can restart my supplement of, just that it's in oil. But a few drops should be fine.
This has taught me something about Peating - why he mentions liver/well cooked greens. Because adding them seems like it would cover just about everything else.
Looked up manganese and see that two cups of black tea would about cover that, and seeing as I was trying to drink a cup a day anyway to address flushing that fits in quite nicely.
About the fruit jelly - it combines a few things I was doing already. It's a boiled sugar syrup with acid + cooked fruit which helps digestibility if not well ripened + lots of gelatin, set not hot which I find digests with no trouble, then of course it is also a protein with sugar which is one reason I add a lot of sugar, the other being it tastes great that way.
So I'm encouraged that I'm making progress towards a diet that works for me. I also have not yet felt low blood sugar in a big way so far, which has always been a big factor for me. And today I am feeling less antsy. No cravings. I do have to eat often to keep it that way but I was doing that anyway to coincide with thyroid every 2 hours.

Re: A fat free, starch free experiment

Ditch eggs, eat small amount of liver. Ditch chicken, eat a small piece of red quality meat, use coconut oil like 10-12g per day.
Drink oj and you can get more protein from no fat quark which taste good with some sugar and berries/fruit.

Also I would really recommend oysters, I think doing Peat without oysters is not at all optimal.
And maybe shrimp. Far more valuable than eggs.

sueq said:

Jennifer that sounds like it would work. Do you just - what - cover the coffee with water and leave it?

Click to expand...

Yeah, you're basically just covering the coffee and leaving it to steep/soak for 24 hours. I follow the instructions in this link:

http://www.thenourishinggourmet.com/201 ... offee.html

I usually give the mason jar a good shake periodically throughout the day to recombine the settled coffee grounds with the water, keeping the grounds submersed as much as possible.

After the 24 hours, I strain it first with a mesh bag, giving the grounds a really good squeeze to get as much concentrate out of them as possible. Then I do another straining through a coffee filter to remove the last bit of particles. If I don't think I'll use all the concentrate up in a week, I freeze some of it to use later.

Jennifer said:

http://www.thenourishinggourmet.com/201 ... offee.html

I usually give the mason jar a good shake periodically throughout the day to recombine the settled coffee grounds with the water, keeping the grounds submersed as much as possible.

After the 24 hours, I strain it first with a mesh bag, giving the grounds a really good squeeze to get as much concentrate out of them as possible. Then I do another straining through a coffee filter to remove the last bit of particles. If I don't think I'll use all the concentrate up in a week, I freeze some of it to use later.

Click to expand...

Maybe this cold brewing is very low caffeine and is suitable for bedtime. I haven't tried it. I know what hot brewing (aka French press) is low-ish caffeine and high nutrients, maybe cold brew also has some nutrients.

Yeah, Ray says that low temp processes get the vitamins and minerals, but a little less caffeine:

"The antioxidants in very fresh coffee might have some special value, but I think instant coffee is on average just as good as brewed coffee. The high temperature of espresso gets the most caffeine, lower temperature processes get the minerals and vitamins (mostly niacin) and aroma, but a little less of the caffeine." RP

Thank you all for these amazing ideas!
I was thinking egg wasn't adding too much to the nutrient list. I could easily replace with liver.
Oysters not available other than farmed in China and tinned. Shrimps I can find.
The last two days I added 1 tsp coconut oil to good effect so will consider 2.
The quark - unless I can make it won't find it here. Lactic acid definitely an issue which makes cottage cheese and yoghurt not ideal. I tried straining yoghurt but still find it very sour. But I'll look into that too.
Rereading old notes peat says leptin lowers appetite but raises inflammation. I've got too much inflammation. But the return of sense of hunger - I was thinking that might be a good sign. It is actually something I've missed for years.

Thanks north and all for the suggestions. I've been tweaking. Adding liver but still eating two eggs, adding milk, another teaspoon of coconut oil, a bit of cottage cheese and tea got all nutrients just about ideal but phosphorus still too high and calories too high too - around 2400-2500. Protein nearly 150 which is nice but maybe not necessary especially with the calcium/phosphorus ratio to fix. For now I'm aiming for 2100 calories and seeing if that works, may tweak later.

When I said my aim was weight loss I should have added but not at the expense of nutrition and health. They come first. Only if it can be done without any losses, in fact I'm hoping for gains in those areas as RP says fat becomes an additional physiological factor creating inflammation etc. I have been needing a breakthrough in all areas.

Back to the drawing board - chronometer- and here's a good list for me:

a cup of sugar (much sweetness is lost when jelly sets. most of my protein comes from jelly and I need to keep carbs up to balance it so I decided to keep this in for now)
2 tsp coconut oil (totally gets rid of unsastisfied cravings. feels great)
40g gelatin ( I think gelatin is the main reason why I'm feeling so good now)
coffee
tea (hot days I prefer this plus helps with flushing I think)
nectarines 6 (whatever fruit is in season - will keep changing - so I'm not going to fret about details like nectarines' strangely high phosphorus rating)
2 litres fat free milk
1oz beef liver

2074 cals
118g protein (23% of cals)
386g carbs (70%)
15g fat (6%)

Vitamins: ample of everything except folate (70%), C (75%), E (42% - I supplement so that's ok), and K (30% - no suitable local supps, will ponder)

Minerals: ample of everything except iron (30% - that's fine by me, I do have some age spots), and the best thing of all is calcium:phosphorus is roughly 2500:2400. Happy about that.

Protein - plenty of everything , glycine doesn't show but will be high.

Fat - approx. 10g sat fat, 2 mono, 1.5 pufa

Not counting the bamboo/carrot with vinegar and tiny bit of olive oil.
Supps as before, B1,3, thyroid, progesterone, cypro.

Next I'm going to try the cold press coffee thing.
It was RP's mention that 100g of gelatin a day as main protein source was fine that got me started and so far I'm finding it very true.

I'm following your experiment with interest sueq!
What brand of gelatin are you using?
And can you describe the jelly you are making and how you make it?

sueq said:

Thank you all for these amazing ideas!
I was thinking egg wasn't adding too much to the nutrient list. I could easily replace with liver.
Oysters not available other than farmed in China and tinned. Shrimps I can find.
The last two days I added 1 tsp coconut oil to good effect so will consider 2.
The quark - unless I can make it won't find it here. Lactic acid definitely an issue which makes cottage cheese and yoghurt not ideal. I tried straining yoghurt but still find it very sour. But I'll look into that too.
Rereading old notes peat says leptin lowers appetite but raises inflammation. I've got too much inflammation. But the return of sense of hunger - I was thinking that might be a good sign. It is actually something I've missed for years.

Click to expand...

Sueq - do you live in the US?? If so, I hear you with the not being able to get good quark - cheese curd is one of my favorite things. However, if you live in an area where there are a lot of Russians or Eastern Europeans, you may be able to find it at a slavic grocery store. I was visiting my friend in Florida recently and there were two Russian markets down the road from her - they had a great tvorog there (same thing as quark). But where I am, there is not a Russian grocery. Closest thing I've found is fat free Ricotta, but they add all sorts of nasties to it. You can, however, make your own quark from raw milk very easily. Fat free quark with honey = yummy.

Where are you getting 26 grams of fat? The foods you listed don't contain even close to that amount of fat... is that a typo?

Fat free did not work for me at all! I didn't lose any weight (even though I'm male), and I felt terrible. I'm supposing it was because I have trouble assimilating vitamins as it is, and then to take away the fat I was probably getting absolutely NO fat soluble vitamins like A, D, E & K which are really important. Low fat as well may compromise the absorption level and for someone who is overweight, which is a protective mechanism against acquired malnutrition, is probably more beneficial to have good fat in the diet.

I am currently using a lot of full fat raw milk, and it's wonderful. I also put excess butter in my food. I feel so much better than I did without fat, and have actually lost two pounds, so at least I know it's not adding to the weight gain. here's a nice article about full fat dairy on NPR: http://www.npr.org/blogs/thesalt/2014/0 ... ep-us-lean

That's interesting. Great that it's working for you! I wasn't feeling good until I added 2 tsps coconut oil. Now I feel good. Even though I've always had butter and for years full fat raw local fresh milk, I'm not missing them. If do I'll add them in.
I think it's possible that fat is protective and with so much breast cancer around ( 3 women in one family I'm friends with) I'd rather be fat . But I'm not making progress with health either and peat says fat can become a physiological factor and I have lots of inflammation to prove it, so I'd like to lose some weight .

Im tweaking all the time, last time I added it all up fat was 15g. Nutrients are almost all accounted for including the fat soluble vitamins. Im trying to listen to my body too, to cravings and how I feel. I find it interesting that covering all nutrients makes me feel replete. Logical but interesting nevertheless and also a useful sign that cravings are meaningful bits of information.

So far energy is better, I actually felt like going for a walk and I did and it was easier than I expected. It's not adrenalin either though I know how easy it is to confuse energy with adrenalin.