Breaking up with LCHF and taking up with Peat

Hi Everyone - I apologize for the long introductory post, but I figured it would be best to get all my background information out there to put my journey in context. I am a 44 year old female. Up until about 3 years ago I was quite healthy, very lean and extremely active (fitness instructor, runner, weight lifter etc). Shortly after my 40th bday I decided to lose the last 10lbs that always bugged me. I purchased an online fitness and nutrition plan and followed it to the letter. It involved 5-6 meals a day, low carb, low fat with 1 hour of cardio a day plus 4 days of weightlifting. It worked quite well and I had lost those 10lbs in about 12 weeks and started to lay down some nice muscle.

I think I lost way more than 10lbs because I was definitely getting very small to the point that size 0 was baggy. I was thrilled, but the hours of food prep a day and the time in the gym was starting to wear on me and causing a strain on my marriage. DH was less than thrilled with my new body....apparently he likes jiggle, grrrr men! I started experiencing severe bloating and gas which I now realize was probably from all the sugar free gum I was chewing to help me stick to the diet. The bloating was horrible and by the end of the day, I looked 6 months pregnant. What was the point of being skinny if I look pregnant right? So I stopped the diet and the exercising and predictably the weight started to come back on. But the bloating didn't go away and my hair started falling out. I decided to go low carb/high fat to try and maintain my weight, so in the summer of 2013 I dropped to <20g carbs. The bloating was better once all vegetables were removed from my diet. However, the fatigue, hairloss and weight gain continued....and I developed acne and highish fbg. I gained about 20lbs in about 4 months. I went to many doctors (10 total - gp, 3 endocrinologists, allergist, gastroenterologist, 2 ER visit, 1 quack, etc.) about the bloating, hairloss, weight gain, high fbg and acne, but no one had any answers.

Last June, I finally got in to see a functional medicine doctor who diagnosed me with chronic and acute lyme. The joint pain that I had in 2001 for 4 years (that no doctor could figure out) was most likely the lyme ...so my bloodwork showed that the infection was still in the acute phase meaning that the body never got a handle on it...or the infection was reactivated. My t3 was abysmally low so she started me on a bunch of supplements and Armour thyroid. All of my hormones were in the deficient range (dhea, insulin, testosterone, thyroid). I have been through several antibiotic and herbal protocols for the lyme, but have made no progress. I have not exercised in 2 years. The doctor wanted me to continue my vlc/zc paleo diet as that was in line with her dietary philosophy.

So after a year of this with no progress, I found Ray Peat on MDA and have decided to try and heal my hormones and hopefully lose some of this weight. I have been semi peating for the last two weeks, but I think I will be more successful if I log my journey and have a place to get support and ask questions. I also bought a spot in a 9 week weight lifting class. I really want to exercise again and replace some of the muscle I have lost...I feel better when I work out and I have followed the advice of others in the past and took two years off and it hasn't helped, so time to try something different. I took my first class on Friday and I was careful to not overdo it. I have to think of myself as a beginner and not grab the weight I used to use. I took the lightest weight for each exercise and although I wanted to vomit the first 10 minutes, after that, I felt good and had no trouble completing the class. I am sore but it is a nice feeling if you know what I mean. The class is at 5 am 3x/week so we'll see how it goes.

So back to peat....I am focusing on lean proteins (mostly gelatin, eggs, dairy and tinned oysters), fruit and oj. Breakfast is usually tea with 2tsp of sugar and 2-3tbs of gelatin and an orange and some grapes or other fruit. Lunch is 2% cottage cheese with fruit....maybe some oj w/gelatin....if I need snacks it is some light jarlsberg cheese with fruit or oj... Dinner is eggs, cheese and fruit or oysters and fruit or meat and fruit. I got a little off track this week and fell into 2 boxes of meringues from trader joes...technically peat, but eating the entire container is doing me no favors weight wise...just after no sugar for soooo long...well you get the idea

If I get brave, I'll take and post my before picture tomorrow. I am going to my functional medicine doctor on Wednesday ....I had some additional lyme/coinfections tests run to see if there is something else that needs to be treated before getting the lyme and an amino acids profile test as well as the usual stuff she always runs....hormones, a1c, cbc, etc. I'm sure she will not be thrilled with my new diet, but I did a meat and water only diet for almost a year to help with the lyme and got nowhere. I couldn't even think of exercising on zc so that fact that I made it through a whole 1 hour class on peat is encouraging.

Interesting thing though is that she ran a 23&me genetic test on me a while ago and it showed that I don't digest fats well....I asked her what I should eat and she was like I don't know because she is very pro LC paleo....so even though the evidence was there that lchf doesn't work with my genetics, she could take that step to tell me to switch to hclf...but 2 years of lchf hasn't worked for me and I never experienced the appetite suppression everyone talks about...so we'll see what she has to say.

Anyways thanks for reading ...I know it was really long....I appreciate anyone who takes the time to stop in here and any feedback is most welcomed.

Had a pretty good day yesterday. Meals were Peaty. Up 1lb this morning WTF. Think it was the honey. I think honey is an issue for me...maybe too much LF cheese....today I will stick with cottage cheese and no regular cheese and no honey...hopefully that will go down tomorrow.


Morning stats: weight 134.6 (ugh and new high for me), FBG 97! yay

I also went to my weightlifting class at 5 am. I felt good the whole time. No urges to vomit from the exertion. Yay. My whole body is jiggling like jello today from the class so I'm happy for my desk job right now. Great energy all day so far. Happy about that. Today's food:

Post workout - grass fed whey protein shake, 1 scoop mixed with 1C skim milk, 1 rice cake (for the insulin spike) and jasmine tea with 3TBS of collagen and 2tsp of sugar drunk about an hr later on my commute.

BF - about 9 am ....1C 2% Kolona Cottage Cheese, 1C Red seedless grapes

Lunch - 1 hardboiled egg, 3 hardboiled whites, 1 whole cantaloupe, 1 packet of sugar in the raw

Dinner will be tri tip steak, carrot, 8 oz of oj w/2tbs collagen, and another piece of fruit

Went to Trader Joe's at lunch and stocked up on fresh squeezed unpasturized OJ, fruit, tri tip and scallops but forgot the oysters...damn...looks like I'll have to go back tomorrow...knew I was forgetting something....but the victory was that I managed to walk by the meringues and not justify purchasing it in my mind....since for me a serving of meringues is the entire container....but now that I have to go back tomorrow there will be another chance at temptation.

How does my menu look? Any suggestions?

Welcome to the group!

Up 1lb this morning WTF. Think it was the honey. I think honey is an issue for me...maybe too much LF cheese....today I will stick with cottage cheese and no regular cheese and no honey...hopefully that will go down tomorrow.

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I don't think that daily tweaks based on the scale are going
to be fruitful in the long run. Try to relax – it looks to me
like you're on the right track. :)

Scott

I agree with Scott 9,000%.

As a woman, you're going to experience more scale fluctuation than men.

I'd go by more how your clothes fit.

I would really focus on the fat soluble vitamins Ray recommends (K2 MK4, E, A, D), as well as getting plenty of minerals (salt, magnesium, potassium, and especially calcium).

Personally, I find that good amounts of bright light are helping my metabolism where 5+ grains of NDT did nothing.

So make sure you get lots of bright light.

Your diet seems pretty good from Ray's recommendations. Does that cottage cheese have gums in it as a thickener? Ray really strongly recommends against those. I use Daisy 2% cottage cheese for that reason.

Any reason you don't drink coffee? Ray, and most of his followers worship the stuff.

youre breaking up with LCHF? was he good in bed? Dam...how'd you pull Peat... that's pretty impressive

anyways yea its good...just some basics, you want to get most of carbs from fruit...some lightly brewed things with sugar is good (or adding sugar to milk). Honey is kind of acidic and certain types can be harsh. The best protein sources are milk and cheese and greek yogurt....cottage cheese is a bit imbalanced and lacks calcium, and you kinda would wanna just supplement egg, seafood, and not make them main sources of protein. Gelatin...im not experienced with, its balanced on paper, but I think the supplemental form is probably giving a lot of people GI distress....if you made it yourself boiling in a pot or whatever it would ...im guessing, be a lot better

Also, welcome to the forum and I hope you find what you need to get back to full health.

I've personally tried Peat style eating 3 times and fudged it up completely the first two times. I'm still eating more starch than I probably should, but I've gotten over my fear of sugar and fruit after being low carb for years.

Oh yeah, Ray doesn't like whey, at all. He recommends people drink more milk.

That's what bodybuilders did in the old days and it worked well.

He talks about 2 quarts of milk and one quart of OJ quite often.

Thanks everyone for all the comments. I'm not looking to tweak based on fluctuations in the scale but I want to keep a detailed record of my journey so will be including stats....I've heard about fluctuations but it seems my weight only fluctuates in 1 direction lol.

The cottage cheese has no gums....it is a really good brand....I obsessively check all labels for added crap...our food supply is definitely declining with all the additives...drives me nuts.

I actually hate protein shakes but had the whey post workout but would welcome other suggestions as to what to have after lifting....a glass of milk doesn't seem like enough....

Pboy - are you saying greek yogurt is better than cottage cheese? I thought Peat doesn't like Yogurt....confused...also eggs and oysters are supplement foods? What should I mostly be eating for protein?

Javacody - I like coffee but sometimes it doesn't sit well or I don't feel good afterward....about a year ago I had the ALCAT done and I showed a moderate (orange) intolerance to coffee. Honey was also an "orange" for me....I've tried Upgraded Coffee and that actually made me feel worse than starbucks or my nespresso machine. So I have just decided to stick with green jasmine tea for now.


In addition to the food I mentioned above I also had 2 packets of sugar in the raw...just licked it off my finger, 3 pieces of juicy fruit and about 1tbs of sweetened condensed milk.

Personally, I love cottage cheese. I have a cup daily. But I also drink at least 2 quarts of milk per day.

As far as protein after your workout, you could drink 2 glasses of milk. :)

PeatJAM

If you've been under eating carbs and then start eating enough of them, I'd hope for more than 1pd glycogen weight gain. :) If you've been low carb for a while, both glucose handling and glycogen storage may be a bit out of practice, so increasing gradually may make sense, as you seem to be doing. Your taste for sugar may be a reasonable guide to what you need.

On the other hand, if your body is trying to make you eat more, you could consider listening to it instead of fighting it? Your body may know what it's doing, making you eat meringues. :) Peat has said that a craving for sugar usually means a need for sugar.

Cottage cheese and greek yogurt both lose quite a bit of calcium with the whey. You can check if you are getting enough calcium with sth like cronometer. Peat usually recommends more calcium than phosphorus. If you are not getting enough calcium from milk, you can supplement with powdered eggshell or oystershell.

Good morning - my last day of work for the summer!! Hoo Hoo.

Morning stats - weight 134.2, FBG 97 (2 days in a row!!), sleep app says I didn't wake up but mostly light sleep.

I tried having a 1/2 of raw whole milk before bed to see if it would help increase deep sleep. Hmmm....tonight maybe I will add collagen and sugar to it. I usually drink skimmed milk but I get raw whole milk for my kids...it is soooo good

I have to go out with breakfast this morning with colleagues so I might have coffee w/skim milk and gelatin this morning and hope I can order a fruit plate at the restaurant. As I've been vlc for soo long, I'm sure there are going to be raised eyebrows at this. Ha.

Tara - I may consider getting the meringues again as it is an easy sugar deliver mechanism for me. I don't like sugar in coffee but coffee w/skimmed milk and meringues sounds yummy. They are super sweet but something about the texture/crunch is so appealing to me. I like fruit ok but was never a big fruit eater so it is hard to get the carbs up....also I seem to want protein more than fruit....I was always more of a savory person than a sweets person.....

It seems like my protein is too high and my carbs too low....but how do you keep protein lower with all the gelatin....or is that even a goal....

What about sweet plantains? If they are very ripe...black spots...and fried in coconut oil would they be ok?

Off to go make some coffee.

Hi,
Peat usually recommends 80-100g protein for people with low thyroid function, and a bit more for healthy folk.
Some refined sucrose is OK, but you also have to get your minerals from some where, so good to get some fruit or juice too.
Some people do fine eating lots of plantains or bananas, others do better without.
Peat has said bananas tend to be grown under very stressful conditions, and this affects their quality. I don't know if plantains have the same issues.
I would say you have to eat something, so if plantains appeal to you, give them a go and see how you respond.

PeatJAM said:

Went to Trader Joe's at lunch and stocked up on fresh squeezed unpasturized OJ, fruit, tri tip and scallops but forgot the oysters...damn...looks like I'll have to go back tomorrow...knew I was forgetting something....but the victory was that I managed to walk by the meringues and not justify purchasing it in my mind....since for me a serving of meringues is the entire container....but now that I have to go back tomorrow there will be another chance at temptation.

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Hi PeatJAM! :)

It's nice to see another member who shops at Trader Joe's. It sick how much I love that store. I think it's partly due to their packaging. I get easily distracted by pretty things. LOL

Anyhow, I didn't know they had fresh squeezed unpasteurized OJ. I went today and completely missed that! Unless of course they don't sell it in my location. I too get their sea scallops. They're the best I've come across and ginormous! I also love their cold-brewed coffee concentrate. Have you seen it? I find it's a lot gentler on my stomach and I think it's because the cold-brewing method makes it less acidic than regular brewed coffee. Plus, it's such a quick and easy way to get the benefits of coffee without overdoing the liquids which can be problematic for some people. I usually add a couple tablespoons of it to a glass of milk with sugar. Very convenient!

Good morning everyone. Morning stats....weight 134.8 (ugh...my own fault though), FBG 98 (3 days in a row below 100...very happy about that).

Jennifer - love TJs...smoked oysters, fresh oj, scallops, fruit...the best....I will try their cold brewed coffee...thanks for the tip.

Yesterday was a terrible day foodwise. I ended up eating an entire box of meringues....I just can't buy those. I think the trouble started in the morning. We took a retiring colleague out for breakfast at a diner and I just ordered a melon (a whole cantaloupe cut up)...didn't want to do eggs because I know they cook in really bad oil...so I think the lack of protein at breakfast set me up to have an off day food wise....I crave protein and fruit only meals just don'tn work for me....so live and learn. Today is my first day of summer break so I will be able to have a little more time to prepare breakfast and quality nutritious meals. I did have 2 yellow plantains fried in coconut oil last night and they were yummy but my bg remained elevated for hours so maybe they aren't a good food for me. FBG was 98 this morning so that was good....

I think I need to have a decent serving of protein at every meal accompanied by fruit/juice....collagen protein doesn't count....it does nothing for my for my satiety....liquid meals just set me up poorly for later in the day.

Today's food - BF - 3 eggs cooked in butter, with 1 slice of light switch and ketchup (no hfcs), 8 oz of oj with 1tbs collagen and pinch of baking soda, coffee w/1c skim milk, 1 tbs gelatin.

Lunch will be on the road -- so will pack 1c 2% cottage cheese, 1C grapes, 1 orange

Dinner will be either jumbo scallops seared in butter or tri tip steak, cantaloupe

Does anyone chew gum (sweetened kind)? If so, what kinds?

I go to my func med dr. today. She said we have 30 pages of bloodwork to go through. I had some additional lyme/co-infections testing and an amino acids profile done....she's going to have a coronary when I tell her how I am eating now...but I did vlc paleo for 2 years and it was an epic fail....

Yes to protein at every meal.

If you are wanting to improve your ability to use glucose, have you come across the Randle cycle? Apparently when there are lots of free fatty acids available, eg from a fatty meal, the cells use less glucose. So if you want them to get back into the habit of burning glucose more efficiently, there may be a benefit in bringing the fat level down.

Can't tell what quantities you are eating, but at a hunch, looking at your menus, I'm wondering if it may not be much? If you are undereating, that can lower metabolism if it wasn't already low, and affect various things.

Morning stats - weight 136.4 (up 2lbs wtf), FBG 105 (not terrible but above 100

Went to doctor yesterday....nothing really new...blood work still showed almost non existent insulin, testosterone and DHEA (I was vlc when this was done so it will be interesting to see what they are going forward when I've been peating a while). Thyroid numbers were the best they've been with Ft3 at 4.2. Other lyme tests were negative but I tested positive for Q Fever and 2 strains of bartonella so I have 4 infections going on (including lyme)....all at once. My amino acids profile was all over the map. Can't say I understand it enough to explain it here. So will be trying antibiotics again to deal with the infections and supplements to deal with the amino acids profile issues....so DHEA, C, Biotin, Liver support supplement, D/k2, pregnenolone, bcomplex, and methylated B vitamins and a probiotic.

She also gave me a Myers Cocktail and a glutathione push. That may explain the 2lb gain this morning....probably the sodium chloride solutions from the IV. She was very open to ray peat eating. She didn't really know much about it, but is a very open minded doctor and said she was going to look into it. Given my genetic and amino acids profile, low fat is the way to go with me. She said based on my results, a lot of my fat is the oxidized kind....great. Not sure when and how my body got so messed up.

So today, I had an 5 egg white omelette with 1 slice of light swiss for bf and 8 oz of oj with 1tbs gelatin and I'm stuffed....can't even think about tea or coffee...maybe later.

Tara - I'm eating about 1800-2200 cal a day (I'm terrible at counting though... and sometimes it is hard to measure when you are out)...so I don't think I'm undereating....but I guess anything is possible.

Morning stats: weight 135.8 (still not down to pre-IV weight but it's a start) FBG 100 Sleep equal parts deep and light sleep

Happy to see my bg come back down a bit and my sleep quality go up. Still trying to figure out what affects the sleep quality. I had a small potato last night with dinner (cooked, cooled and reheated). Maybe that was it. Will have another one tonight and see if I get the same results. I'm not sure what Peat's stand is on potatoes. I don't have to have it and I know he prefers fruit to starch, but I remember seeing potatoes on the infographic. Not sure if it is the starch or the resistant starch that could have the sleep affect or maybe it wasn't the potato at all....will see what tonight brings ...the potato was 6 oz but only ate about half but if it can improve my sleep quality, I will make it a staple for dinner.

I was so not hungry yesterday. Not sure what to make of it. Not that hungry today either even though I had bootcamp this morning. I'm of 2 minds....it could be the antibiotic I started yesterday - but that seems really quick to have such an effect and I've been on doxy before and it didn't curb my appetite.....or it was the Myers cocktail/glutathione IV I got...maybe my body was deficient in something that the IV took care of so my body doesn't need to have this raging appetite. I even had meringues (my big weakness) and I could barely eat 4 (which is a normal serving size as opposed to the whole container 28 meringues which I was doing before). Will be interesting to see if this lasts...

Today's food:

BF - 5 egg white omlette with 1 oz light swiss cooked in .5tsp ghee, 8 oz oj w 1tbs of gelatin, tea w 1c skim milk and 2tbs gelatin

Lunch - 1-2oz fresh mozzarella, coffee w/3/4c skim milk, 1tbs collagen,4 meringues, 1 mango

Dinner - will be tri tip steak, small reheated potato and cherries (or atleast that's the plan right now).

Hi PeatJAM,
I was surprised saw your thread title, since I am doing almost exactly the reverse. I recently went back to lowish carb and high fat, after three years trying to eat Peat-style. I thought fruit and sugar would be good to raise my thyroid, but it actually didn't change it at all...it did give me the only potbelly (and highest weight) ever in my life. (I am female, almost 40, was eating low carb for years before Peating. My thyroid and health was actually best about 5 years ago, doing "Polish Atkins")

I do have to credit this forum for introducing me to natural desiccated thyroid, which has helped my health enormously. However, the "Ray Peat diet" has not.

I have gotten into Paul Jaminet's diet now, a kind of lowish carb version (80-100 grams). Its surprisingly similar to Polish Atkins (Paul has mentioned this himself on his blog in the past, although he has moved away from low carb.)

This is likely my last post on this forum. Hope you (and everyone here) attain the good health you are looking for!

Morning stats - weight 134.8 so back to pre-iv weight, fbg 114 (wtf - back up), sleep quality poor according to jawbone

Ended up going to get a new car yesterday and it took forever...3 hours....so by then dh had to go get kids from camp and everyone was hungry so we ended up at the diner for dinner. I had a greek egg white omlette - feta, olives, tomatoes and peppers (seemed pretty peat) but they had no oj....ate the potatoes that came with the omlette...it wasn't that much and they weren't oily, but I'm sure the potatoes and omelette were cooked in a crap oil...oh well...had a couple of bites of ds's ice cream and had some meringues when I got home to balance everything out, but definitely not an ideal peat meal...but sometines life gets in the way.

Since my sleep quality was poor, and I had potatoes, it may not be the potatoes that gave me the good sleep the other day....but it is possible that the cooked and cooled version would be better....so will have those tonight to make sure I've tested all potato variables. It may also explain the 15pt rise in my bg....regular potatoes/starch raises fbg but cooked and cooled potatoes don't....we'll see what happens tonight/tomorrow.

Arinryan - I was sooooo convinced that lchf was THE way to go that I ignored the fact that I gained 20lbs, lost any kind of exercise stamina (even walks were tiring), and tanked my thyroid for two years. I don't know if Peat is the answer (I hope it is) If I learned anything from lchf is n=1 is sooo much more important than theory, dogma or experts....so I will experiment and see but not be afraid to abandon the experiment at anytime.

arinryan said:

Hi PeatJAM,
I was surprised saw your thread title, since I am doing almost exactly the reverse. I recently went back to lowish carb and high fat, after three years trying to eat Peat-style. I thought fruit and sugar would be good to raise my thyroid, but it actually didn't change it at all...it did give me the only potbelly (and highest weight) ever in my life. (I am female, almost 40, was eating low carb for years before Peating. My thyroid and health was actually best about 5 years ago, doing "Polish Atkins")

I do have to credit this forum for introducing me to natural desiccated thyroid, which has helped my health enormously. However, the "Ray Peat diet" has not.

I have gotten into Paul Jaminet's diet now, a kind of lowish carb version (80-100 grams). Its surprisingly similar to Polish Atkins (Paul has mentioned this himself on his blog in the past, although he has moved away from low carb.)

This is likely my last post on this forum. Hope you (and everyone here) attain the good health you are looking for!

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Do you think you got any benefit from the pufa reduction?
Can I just ask you what Polish Atkins is before you go? Good luck too.