2014 Study: Normal Sugar Consumption Not Associated With Health Problems

LucH

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Wilfrid said:
"
1.As for Pr. Joyeux, I read the books he wrote in the nineties ....almost the exact opposite of what he recommends now....
2. Same case with the work of his friend Seignalet, he was very close to his friend's conclusions
3. but after Seignalet's death, he took his ( diet ) distances....
4. I was listening to one of his radio interview lately and , bam, he did it again with "the acid-base diet" that he was promoting 20 years ago based on Kousmine's work ( heavily based on whole grains, raw and cooked vegetables, fruits, juices, one intake max of protein a day, budwig type breakfast, nuts, vegetable oils ( sunflower, flaxseed oil, vitamins injections ect....)). 5.So no, same as Dr Cordain in a different way, I'm not a huge fan....
Well, I see what you're doing ...
So I'm not going to try to convince a deaf ...
Just to correct what is wrong
one point : Joyeux took his distance on one point because Seignalet made an mistake: He took pre-enzymes, thinking it were enzymes. Nobody has the entire solution ...
One more :[highlight=yellow]eating meat won't acidify your oragnism if you balance with fruit and vegetable[/highlight]: Mg K Ca against P and S.
See JP Curtay for details.
Oh, yes: I'm stupid. If one point is false, the rest is rubbish. ;)
Let me tell this for the other readers, not hermetic:
In case of failure at the base level inputs (alkalizing minerals), the removal mechanisms are less efficient (detox).
If you eat little or not very often herbs, herbal infusions and especially vegetables and fruits, you will miss chemical workers that allow the kidneys to remove acids. "
Source: Dr H. C. Peter Jentschura
PS: probably yet one sixies old-fashioned :lol:

One more for the route:
Don't stimulate too much the Mtor pathway if you have family problems with immunity. Associate "Mtor + oncogene", for a Google search ...
No problem if you eat fish, poultry and not too much beef. Organic and local cattle is ok if not fed with corn but free grazing.
:yellohello
LucH
 
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burtlancast

burtlancast

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Giraffe said:
LucH said:
So I'm not going to try to convine a deaf ...
This is arrogant!

We french people, we like to have from time to time a free for all...

(it's a french thing) :lol:

asterix-bagarre-generale.jpg
 
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Wilfrid said:
burtlancast said:
Wilfrid said:
I think someone said that study was bad or something.

Here, always interesting:

http://peatarianreviews.blogspot.fr/201 ... erior.html

Mmm.

"White is right about our abstract. We were not able to repeat the observations, and found out that the calibration samples were not properly prepared leading to systematic errors. "

My shill o'meter just went off reading this...

(surely a calibration error from my part... ;) )

PS: this is coming from the same site claiming "The daily raw carrot is not antiseptic"...

Burt,

I'm starting to know you......You're being sarcastic...and you want to hurt my ( french ) feelings. You know what....
There is a russian saying..... that it's easier to hurt one's feelings than to create a real friendship :cry: ( I will let you add the adequate music....)

I think he means the shills would be the author or the people who put pressure on the author.
 

Giraffe

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burtlancast said:
We french people, we like to have from time to time a free for all...(that's a french thing) :lol:
... hmm, I thought the French were polite and eloquent. :lol:
 

tara

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LucH said:
There not only one thruth, isn't it?
I think the pursuit of science and knowledge requires an assumption that there is one reality (though maybe various models/maps etc of it in all our heads).

Unless you just mean that different people in different states will have different needs and responses?
 

Wilfrid

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723
LucH said:
Wilfrid said:
"
1.As for Pr. Joyeux, I read the books he wrote in the nineties ....almost the exact opposite of what he recommends now....
2. Same case with the work of his friend Seignalet, he was very close to his friend's conclusions
3. but after Seignalet's death, he took his ( diet ) distances....
4. I was listening to one of his radio interview lately and , bam, he did it again with "the acid-base diet" that he was promoting 20 years ago based on Kousmine's work ( heavily based on whole grains, raw and cooked vegetables, fruits, juices, one intake max of protein a day, budwig type breakfast, nuts, vegetable oils ( sunflower, flaxseed oil, vitamins injections ect....)). 5.So no, same as Dr Cordain in a different way, I'm not a huge fan....
Well, I see what you're doing ...
So I'm not going to try to convince a deaf ...
Just to correct what is wrong
one point : Joyeux took his distance on one point because Seignalet made an mistake: He took pre-enzymes, thinking it were enzymes. Nobody has the entire solution ...
One more :[highlight=yellow]eating meat won't acidify your oragnism if you balance with fruit and vegetable[/highlight]: Mg K Ca against P and S.
See JP Curtay for details.
Oh, yes: I'm stupid. If one point is false, the rest is rubbish. ;)
Let me tell this for the other readers, not hermetic:
In case of failure at the base level inputs (alkalizing minerals), the removal mechanisms are less efficient (detox).
If you eat little or not very often herbs, herbal infusions and especially vegetables and fruits, you will miss chemical workers that allow the kidneys to remove acids. "
Source: Dr H. C. Peter Jentschura
PS: probably yet one sixies old-fashioned :lol:

One more for the route:
Don't stimulate too much the Mtor pathway if you have family problems with immunity. Associate "Mtor + oncogene", for a Google search ...
No problem if you eat fish, poultry and not too much beef. Organic and local cattle is ok if not fed with corn but free grazing.
:yellohello
LucH

LucH,

No need to be rude...but no,no,no not Jentschura.....The german guy who is selling a bunch of crappy stuff and that spoke about the role played by the devil ( as a huge factor of acidification, do you remember Jentschura's scale on basic and acid factors in his book? ) on acid-base balance....I mean...Jentschura,really??
When you're telling that meat will acidify the organism...you are making the reference to the catabolism of sulfur containing amino acids that needs buffering action of cations to be excreted by the kidneys? As far as phosphorus goes, I think this anion ( in animal proteins, and in the case of the below study ) could prevent further loss of urinary calcium excretion ( which is always a strong indicator of acidification ), so maybe its role in acid-base balance is far more complex....

http://journals.cambridge.org/download. ... a/userPdf/
If you don't want to read the full study, you can go the Urinary Ca part and the protective role of P ( as in animal proteins, milk in this case ) on the calciuria.

But again, I will not read Jentschura!!
JP Curtay, interesting input for vitamins and minerals but not enough information about vitamins/vitamins and vitamins/minerals unhealthy interactions in supplements ( as for example, the strong allergic reactions that one can sometimes experience when taking, in the same supplement, sulfur containing vitamins and the ( only ) one who contains cobalt...but there is plenty of other interactions....) especially when he try to sell his products via la nutrition.fr ( as you know is a friend of Thierry Souccar, they wrote a book together on vitamins...), D-stress, for example....
Another interesting point, Seignalet and Joyeux were both ( and still is for Joyeux ) very good friends of Dr Claude Lagarde ( CEO of the selling vitamins and minerals company NUTERGIA )..,do we shall see anything wrong here? Remember that Seignalet was recommending Nutergia products in his book ( cf Biocébé, Nutergia's probiotics ( L. rhamnosus strain ) for ex...) and that Pr Joyeux is still offering people some ( pricy ) seminar with his precious friend....And that nutergia is still manufacturing products for the Kousmine association....It seems that we do have here a " small " friends business, don't you think?
As for the nutrition part, Curtay is also a close friend of Dr Rueff ( who is a fan of some interesting blood test ( for detecting food intolerance) which usually start around 200 euros ( up sometimes to 500 euros...Immupro, that sounds familiar to you,no?)). Rueff medical consultation starts around 175 euros ( knowledge has a price, I know...unless someone ,with empathic faculties , willingly offers to " teach " it for free. ).
As for the " deaf " part, I know it's really annoying...but LucH...may the force be with you...perseverance is the key here.
Of all the responses you've got here, I thought I was one of the less arrogant...but Burt's right, it's a french thing :lol:
 

Wilfrid

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burtlancast said:
Mon cher Wilfred, i was just trying to be a little funny.

No pun intended. :)

But again, doesn't this site raise a few questions marks to you ?

:D .
Yes,it does.
The guy who own the site is Bukowski. On peatarian.com, he was doing a great job as to promote statins as a fantastic medication....
I'm with you ( on this one... :cool: )!!
Plus, I now have a dispute with another french....c'est pas possible, vous êtes insupportables vous les français!!!!
 
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burtlancast

burtlancast

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Ils sont fous ces francais !

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tara

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jyb said:
I have not seen hard numbers about this HBA1C for sugar versus PUFA. But it would be relevant to this discussion, certainly more relevant than exogenous dietary AGEs and stuff in my opinion.
That would be very interesting to see, if it has been studied. :)
 
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I think someone did that on a blog. Not sure.
 

jyb

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tara said:
jyb said:
I have not seen hard numbers about this HBA1C for sugar versus PUFA. But it would be relevant to this discussion, certainly more relevant than exogenous dietary AGEs and stuff in my opinion.
That would be very interesting to see, if it has been studied. :)

There are certainly people out there who think high blood sugar is even worse than PUFA for HBA1C. But it seems difficult to know exactly because either one won't necessarily cause high HBA1C. But it should be possible to determine with diabetics data, in particular whether those who keep blood glucose stable if they succeed to normalise HBA1C (it is supposed to happen). If HBA1C in diabetics rise when they start to get hyperglycaemia and normalises after a glucose stabilising diet, then that's evidence against high blood sugar against HBA1C rather than PUFA which presumably doesn't change that much.
 

tara

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jyb said:
tara said:
jyb said:
I have not seen hard numbers about this HBA1C for sugar versus PUFA. But it would be relevant to this discussion, certainly more relevant than exogenous dietary AGEs and stuff in my opinion.
That would be very interesting to see, if it has been studied. :)

There are certainly people out there who think high blood sugar is even worse than PUFA for HBA1C. But it seems difficult to know exactly because either one won't necessarily cause high HBA1C.

I had only heard about HBA1C being a measure of chronically too high blood sugar.
 

Tarmander

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I'm a type 1 diabetic, I get my A1c tested every few months to six months. Blood sugar control definitely impacts it. If my blood sugar is low all the time, which when I was growing up it often was, your a1c will tend to be lower. Same for higher.

I don't see it as a question of pufa vs. blood sugar. If i take a bunch of fish oil and totally suppress my immune system, in my case, my a1c will be lower. I know I have tried it. Lots of pufa, low a1c.

If I were to take a bunch of pufa and stop taking insulin, wouldn't matter much, high a1c. See? They aren't really connected...A1c is a basic measurement of average blood sugar in the past three to four months. If you eat lots of pufa and damage your cells, you could have a high a1c, but it wouldn't be from the pufa, it would be from the damaged cells.
 

LucH

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tara said:
I had only heard about HBA1C being a measure of chronically too high blood sugar.

info about HbA1c (glycated hemoglobin)

The A1C test result reflects your average blood sugar level for the past two to three months. Specifically, the A1C test measures what percentage of your hemoglobin — a protein in red blood cells that carries oxygen — is coated with sugar (glycated). The higher your A1C level, the poorer your blood sugar control and the higher your risk of diabetes complications.
This can also help determine how well a person's diabetes is being controlled over time. The test is also useful to monitor treatment in patients with established diabetes.
A1C is only a sign of the red blood cell, living +/ 120 days.
Thus, measurements of HbA1c are helpful to detect diabetes as well as monitoring therapy in those already being treated for diabetes. The higher the HbA1c, the greater the risk of developing diabetes-related complications.
Don’t trust Diabetes Associations recommending HbA1c below 7% (53 mmol/mol) for most patients. 5 is the recommended upper limit. At 6 the problems begin: Diabetes is announced 5 or 10 years later. The risks is not linear. Instead, the risk escalates.
When you adapt your glycaemia not to suffer from hypoglycaemia, it changes the score but it doesn’t change the rest. You can then monitor glycaemia.

To reverse inner blood cells destruction (AGE, RAGE, and Tissue Damage), there are some known inhibitors: Benfotiamine, aminoguanidine, L-carnosine are very useful.
Other inhibitors of protein glycation include vitamin C and E, acetyl salicylic acid (aspirin), polyphenols and metal ion chelators (acid lipoid e.g.). These last ones are useful preventively but not too efficient when the consequences are present (nerve attack). Some inhibitors may intercept the formation of AGEs but also counteract or interfere with enzyme metabolism.
So we have to adapt and to make pauses. Prevention is best, of course.
I make a cure of 3-4 months, twice a year, with "Anti-Glycation Formula".
I’m not diabetics but my grandmother was. My mother became diabetics at 50 years old.
I’m 62. Not diabetics but my previous blood test indicated 5.8 five years ago. Now, I have 5.3.
We can counteract the normal evolution if we adapt ourselves, not too late ...
:yellohello
LucH
 

messtafarian

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I think sometimes people read into Peat too much. My take is that his first impulse is to be a contrarian and simply try to get people to look at science in a calm and reasonable way instead of throwing themselves into harmful diet practices based on marketing and not science.

He has nothing against sugar OR saturated fat OR really even starch. His real argument is anti-corporate. While people are dialectically analyzing sugar molecules and giving it up because it "increases insulin"; or giving up saturated fat because it "creates heart disease" the one thing no one is noticing is that their milk is full of allergenic seaweed molecules and their bread is 25 percent canola oil. HCFS is perfectly fine compared to a diet full of transfats.

The basic macronutrients can really be ingested in any combination -- his real issue is that our food supply is essentially poisoned.
 

tara

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@LucH
I gather yours is the standard model (apart from possibly the exact level to be concerned about), which i was already aware of.
I am curious about whether there are other interpretations, for instance it would be interesting if there were a strong correlation with PUFA consumption or PUFA blood levels and Hb1Ac. I took this to be Jyb's meaning.
 

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