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Birdie

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Another thought is that a lot of things when applied to the skin are absorbed differently than by mouth. Filtered in a way. Ray puts his vit A and D on the skin. He says it's a safer way to dose them because of additives if I remember right.

And, the fact that he advises using baking soda and epsom salts through the skin in the bath indicates to me that he isn't worried about the water in the bath. Also, I think most cities in the US are fluoridated, and, still he recommends the bath. When he thinks something (meat for example) is better in Mexico, he says he eats more meat there. But he hasn't said he takes more soaks there because of our fluoride. But, is his water in Mexico fluoridated too. Does he take the baths himself anyway?
 

nwo2012

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Re: Notes Toward a Handle like a "Basic Peat Diet" (BPD)

Birdie said:
nwo2012 said:
Birdie said:
Some more Peat Items for consideration in a list:

Epsom Salts (Magnesium sulfate) - bath

Baking soda - bath, added to oj
Bag breathing, nose breathing, etc..

Aspirin, vit K, niacinamide, vitamin E, progesterone

As long as we are talking bathing in non-fluoridated water, otherwise can only be detrimental to health. Sadly, I can not take baths as the Australian government are a bunch of ****s.

Is the water fluoridated throughout Australia? Just certain areas/cities? I live in a place with it's own wells. Still, I'm sure it's got some awful stuff in it but no fluoride. It's been years since I looked up the info on our water. When I lived in Victoria, BC, I was told their water has no fluoride but is chlorinated. I avoided it. Also, I don't like to swim in it and that might be similar to soaking in fluoridated water as far as being harmful.

But Peat has never to my knowledge advised avoiding soaking baths if your water is fluoridated, as is most people's water. Maybe I missed it though as it sounds like something important to consider.

So, I wonder if I missed something or did Ray miss something. He warns about drinking fluoridated water so, fluoride's danger is not something he ignores. Maybe somebody has more info. Probably, we shouldn't include the baths until we learn more. ??

Yes, most of Australia is fluoridated. In fact it has the highest % of any country, why when I see people proudly singing Australia Fare it makes me want to vomit.
I did ask Peat about the fluoride on the skin and he replied
Since some T3 is produced in the skin, I would expect fluoride to have some local effects on the skin, such as interference with pigment formation, healing, and elasticity.

My concerns are that some of the fluoride will go systemic. Fluoride baths used to be a treatment for hyperthyroidism.
Around the same time (1932) Gorlitzer von Mundy, being aware that fluorides also get absorbed through the skin, began fluoride treatments of hyperthyroid patients in Austria by prescribing 20 minute baths containing 30ccm (0.03l) HF per 200 liters of water. He reported on his successful treatment spanning over 30 years and involving over 600 patients at a 1962 symposium on fluoride toxicityin Bern, also attended by other world-leading experts includingGeorge Waldbott

For me personally, this is too great a risk. It is the fluoride of Australia that caused my hypothyroidism and Im still detoxing from it. This was confirmed by symptoms and bloodwork.
 

nwo2012

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I asked RP again about this and my concerns. H replied:

The magnesium probably reduces the amount that reacts with the skin, and probably very little is absorbed, but it's still better not to have it in the water.
 

Birdie

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Good to see Ray's response. I've noticed that when he makes recommendations and then someone questions them, he will give that sort of answer. Some other thing, the magnesium in the bath, the progesterone in the milk, that covers it.

It'd be better not to have fluoridated water but most of us do. Peat still recommends the bath. But he doesn't recommend drinking it. We'd get a lot more fluoride from drinking the water than we would in the bath, especially with the Mg acting to reduce absorption of fluoride through the skin. Anyway, I'm satisfied on the epsom salt/baking powder baths. (For now!)
 

nwo2012

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Birdie said:
Good to see Ray's response. I've noticed that when he makes recommendations and then someone questions them, he will give that sort of answer. Some other thing, the magnesium in the bath, the progesterone in the milk, that covers it.

It'd be better not to have fluoridated water but most of us do. Peat still recommends the bath. But he doesn't recommend drinking it. We'd get a lot more fluoride from drinking the water than we would in the bath, especially with the Mg acting to reduce absorption of fluoride through the skin. Anyway, I'm satisfied on the epsom salt/baking powder baths. (For now!)

So are you meaning that you think maybe he just makes up things to cover what he said? Just wondering what's on your mind, not insinuating anything. ;) Maybe he does recommend the things in the first place because he already knows of the protective elements so when questioned already has the answer?
Anyways I guess I agree but I will have to mull it over for a while before considering a bath. I do know the hotter the water, the more fluoride you would absorb. Also I would think chlorine would exacerbate the issue (another haline) so using a bath chlorine removing ball (I have one of these) before getting into the bath would be useful. Maybe even a small amount of iodine into the water?
 

peatarian

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Selenium, Egg shell powder,

Thank you for the great list!
You could add super selenium complex. Ray Peat always recommended eating shrimp for selenium but since most of them (and shellfish) come from aqua culture they don't have selenium anymore. So now he recommends supplements.

Also recommended: egg shell powder as best source of calcium.

I am not sure about the training masks. They sounded great at first but after reading how they are supposed to work I think they train you to inhale deeper after wearing them. If you inhale deeper you will take in more oxygen. The opposite of the desired result. Has anyone asked RP what he thinks about this?
 

charlie

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Peatarian, welcome to the forum.

Thats a really great point you have made about the masks. Hoping we can get some more feedback on them.
 

peatarian

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Thanks a lot for the welcome and for the quick answer! Ray Peat never mentioned a special form of selenium to me. I think I checked the Super Selenium Complex from Life Extension with him. I suppose he would have mentioned if there was a better form. But I cannot say anything about the quality. If there are additives (which I am rather sure of) and which ones.
 

charlie

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I did notice it has vitamin E included with it. Not sure what kind of vitamin E though.
 

peatarian

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Yes, I noticed the vitamin E (as D-Alpha tocopherol, it seems to be hard to find a product without it) but the amount is practically nothing so it will not interfere with the suggested 400.000 I.U. of E complex per day.

Vitamin E (as D-alpha tocopheryl)
30 IU
Selenium (as Se-Methyl L-Selenocysteine, SelenoPure™ L-selenomethionine1, sodium selenate, selenodiglutathione)
200 mcg
Each capsule provides:

Selenium (L-selenomethionine1)
50 mcg
Selenium (sodium selenate)
50 mcg
Selenium (selenodiglutathione)
25 mcg
Selenium (Se-Methyl L-Selenocysteine)
75 mcg
Other ingredients: rice flour, gelatin, vegetable stearate, dicalcium phosphate, microcrystalline cellulose.
 

peatarian

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One more suggestion since you listed everything else I could think of for the Ray-Peat-Survival-Kit: activated charcoal might belong with the other stuff.

RP says carott salat has the same effect but from time to time carotts just aren't strong enough. He sent me some rat studies which show that rats eating charcoal (I think every few days) lived 30% longer than those who didn't. Of course the carbo medicinalis (the official name) works as the carott fibers would but are more potent. They soak up the endotoxins in your stomach and intestines. I use charcoal once a week or if needed, two big spoons in water. It's a bit nasty to handle and it turns your tongue black but whenever my teeth or one of them hurts -- It helps. Probably has to do with the elevated serontonin because of the endotoxins. RP mentions it in the articles about MS and other so called autoimmune diseases.
You just have to be sure not to use it close to supplements or food. At least one hour or better one and a half between charcoal and anything beneficial.
 

charlie

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Is there a certain brand you would recommend for charcoal?
 

peatarian

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Don't buy the pressed pills, they are nearly useless. I think it should be at least two big spoons of charcoal but I have used as many as 10 after a stomach infection.

Actually I would recommend the one you can afford. Don't laugh I mean it!
You wouldn't believe it's basically burned things you buy. I used to pay 56 Euro for 250g.
I now found a pharmacy in Switzerland that charges 22 Euro for 1 kg.
There is no qualitative difference between the two. They don't have brand names, just the names of the pharmacies on them.

Basically I'd say chose the one that's finer and easier to stir up dust (you'll see what I mean).
They all have to me medically pure so you don't have to worry about that.
Some are burned plants instead of animals (I wonder if this has to do with religion or vegetarians?). I have tried many, the result was always the same.

After two years I recommend using it -- and using it right before bedtime because this way it's most unlikely it will interfere with any nutrition. (And don't wear anything white when you mix it. I usually fill it in a glass bottle and shake it until it's all liquid and no powder.)
 

Kemby

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Just ordered some Thyroid-S like Hoppimike and was also not charged postage. Interesting!
 

charlie

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Yeh it seems they include their shipping in the price no matter where they ship it to. Can't beat that!
 

healing

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How much baking soda do you use in the baths and add to drinks? Do you ever notice any digestive problems from the baking soda? What benefits do feel from using it? Thanks!
 

Birdie

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I add a cup or two of baking soda to my bath along with the same amount of epsom salts. Sometimes I add aspirin powder too. (Thanks, Peatarian for that one!)

I don't eat a lot of it. Just a little in my oj.

I experience sounder sleep but the other beneficial effects are not something I notice from day to day.
 

Kemby

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How often do you need to have baths like this to absorb an optimal amount of Magnesium and sodium?

Just looking for a ballpark. Im lucky enough that where I live the water has no added flouride.
 

Birdie

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I've heard 4 a week. I get 4 or 5 a week. Some were saying to use a pound of each but I use less. The baths are for magnesium and CO2. I add the aspirin as peatarian said it might help my fibromyalgia. These baths also help with sleep if taken near bedtime.
 

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