Antihistamines can treat anxiety-based disorders like PTSD

Scientific studies related to Ray Peat and his work.

Antihistamines can treat anxiety-based disorders like PTSD

Unread postby haidut » Thu Oct 24, 2013 11:37 pm

The specific drug studied was diphenhydramine (Benadryl), which Ray Peat recommends for several problems including endotoxin protection and liver support.
http://psychcentral.com/news/2013/10/23 ... 61082.html
http://www.pnas.org/content/early/2013/ ... l.pdf+html

However, I have seen pretty similar results for cyproheptadine, which is also antihistamine in action.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9606583
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10964879

So, it seems that this may be a general property of the antihistamines. I wonder what the mechanism of action is. Based on Peat's ideas anxiety/PTSD/panic are probably caused by serotonin so that explains why cyproheptadine is effective since it's a general serotonin inverse agonist. But if Benadryl is working as well, then does that imply Benadryl has anti-serotonin action as well???
Maybe somebody already exchanged emails with Peat on Benadryl and how he thinks the drug achieves its effects. So, please share what you know.
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Re: Antihistamines can treat anxiety-based disorders like PT

Unread postby pranarupa » Fri Oct 25, 2013 2:34 am

Not sure if other things are involved, but I'd guess that anything that inhibits the phase transition that releases histamine from platelets and mast cells also inhibits serotonin release.

Not familiar with benadryl, my quack answer to everything is check your breathing, if you're losing co2 then everything's going to start going wonky.
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Re: Antihistamines can treat anxiety-based disorders like PT

Unread postby Peata » Fri Oct 25, 2013 6:57 am

You might be interested in this discussion on Benadryl and serotonin: viewtopic.php?f=11&t=2248
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Re: Antihistamines can treat anxiety-based disorders like PT

Unread postby pboy » Fri Oct 25, 2013 9:40 am

hmm...I think it can help, but its probably not due to a special healing property, but rather due to pure quieting of certain parts of the mind...I've drinking very strong antihistamine herbs, such as nettle leaf and others, and it does I guess reduce anxiety, but pretty much makes you want to pass out and stay out...until a really good nap is taken. I suppose that's how bendryl works, a deep rejuvanative, but mroeso due to the fact that allows, and almost requires, a good nap
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Re: Antihistamines can treat anxiety-based disorders like PT

Unread postby lindsay » Fri Oct 25, 2013 10:19 am

if only benadryl didn't make me so drowsy :? what about loratadine? I find it helps my histamine problems without making me sleepy.
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Re: Antihistamines can treat anxiety-based disorders like PT

Unread postby SAFarmer » Sat Oct 26, 2013 1:05 am

lindsay wrote:if only benadryl didn't make me so drowsy :? what about loratadine? I find it helps my histamine problems without making me sleepy.


Hi Lindsay

My son uses Loratadine too with good results. Here is a post I made about it in another thread,
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=2508&p=31355#p31355

Cyproheptadine is a 1st generation anti-histamine drug. Second generation variants include cetirizine and loratadine with fewer side effects like drowsiness, etc. My son uses the last 2 and have very good response for hayfever and general better feeling when stressed because of the hayfever allergic reactions.

Ray Peat has said that it is anti estrogenic and thats probably why he responds so well on it.
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Re: Antihistamines can treat anxiety-based disorders like PT

Unread postby haidut » Sat Oct 26, 2013 5:33 pm

Hi SAFarmer,

I saw your earlier post about loratadine and how it is anti-estrogenic. Are you sure Peat was talking about loratadine or cyproheptadine? I have some references that loratadine is actually quite estrogenic. If you are in contact with Peat I'd like to hear his opinion on this study:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16407038

Not trying to be contrarian here, just saying that I did some research on the anti-histamines several years ago and they pretty much all have a warning that side effects may include low libido and even erectile dysfunction. As you can see, the study above found out a lot more than just dysfunction.
Notably, drugs without such warning are Benadryl and cyproheptadine, which is why Peat probably has less issue suggesting them for use.
Thoughts?
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Re: Antihistamines can treat anxiety-based disorders like PT

Unread postby SAFarmer » Sun Oct 27, 2013 5:06 am

Hi Haidut

You are perfectly in your right to question. I don't have an issue with it and just want to learn and know the truth as well.

I did read it somewhere, and remember discussing it with my wife as well, because I am generally very sceptical of pharmaceutical drugs, and she said my son reacts well to Loratadine. I should have posted the source, but don't know why I didn't. I tried again to find the quote, but can't remeber where it was, or it was maybe a radio interview.

Anyway, the closest I could find again, was this quote,

http://raypeat.com/articles/hormones/h1.shtml
Histamine mimics estrogen's effects on the uterus, and antihistamines block estrogen's effects (Szego, 1965, Szego and Davis, 1967).

So I stand corrected, but it could also possibly have been my interpretation of all antihistamines being anti estrogen like. Cyproheptadine generally causes side effects like drowsiness and Loratadine do not do this to my son, which is why my wife gives it to him when needed.

As to your quoted study, I cannot comment, as there is too little information available regarding dosage and also rats vs humans. (even if it were true, luckily my son is not in the uterus anymore ! :D )
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Re: Antihistamines can treat anxiety-based disorders like PT

Unread postby Mittir » Sun Oct 27, 2013 7:24 am

Here is a RP email advice to Charlie on use of Cetirizine. I believe it is also applicable to
Loratadine , because there is chlorine attached to carbon molecule of Loratadine

Ray Peat wrote: I avoid drugs that contain chlorine or fluorine, because of the risk to the liver.
(and gave me the research)

When I asked him about Benadryl containing chloride, and even salt does, he clarified:

Ray Peat wrote: Our enzymes aren't designed for the combination of chlorine with carbon molecules.

He gave me this research:.


Full response with studies at
viewtopic.php?f=68&t=1035&p=13904&hilit=benadryl#p13904
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Re: Antihistamines can treat anxiety-based disorders like PT

Unread postby aquaman » Sun Oct 27, 2013 10:27 am

INteresting - I took a cetirizine 2 hours ago (often get nasal drip after a coffee, was really bad today, i'm sure coffee doesn't agree with me!), and I feel very calm and focused now - doing some work on my business, boring accounts, but actually way more focused than normal.
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