Experimenting with other solvents besides DMSO and SFA

[Jessie]

I think mine is also PureBulk. I have a feeling that they just don't micronize it as well, or don't test it. Micronized products can still be a different size, so they might put only some effort into and that's it.

These problems are really annoying because it makes it difficult to collect information. I ran so many tests, but I can't give any exact numbers because i'm not willing to run many tests for one combination, or wait hours to make sure something is fully dissolved. I did something like 1:1 PG and oleic acid, and that held maybe 100mg/ml of DHEA? It could have easily been much less because I didn't wait days to see if it would crash.

To get an accurate result I would probably need to use a large batch, and slowly raise the hormone concentration by miniscule amounts. (its unreasonable to add like 1mg to a 1ml solution, lol) Perhaps this is where your mixer would be extremely useful, because you could just turn on the mixing and go do something else. But that still requires wasting a lot of product to just find solvent capacity of a combination that won't even be the end result and could still crash since you need to make an emulsion still. (although maybe for ethyoxydiglycol its worth it?)

Back to the emulsion topic. If the micelle walls are indeed holding hormone, then microemulsions could hold much more, I think. Since microemulsions' micelles are 10-100x smaller, there is a much larger surface area and therefore more space for the hormone to incorporate itself. On the other hand, usually the oil phase is much smaller (but surfactant is a massive %). Realistically, even if it would only hold 100mg/ml it would still be incredibly potent due to the fact that its a microemulsion.

Yeah, the measuring equipment you'd need to make a literal 1ml solution would be so small, lol. Not sure that would be easily found. The smallest measuring beacons I've been able to find is 10ml, which might be useful for this. You could fill it half-way with solvent, it's not like 5mls would be a huge waste if the solution doesn't hold. I wouldn't be surprised though if PG & OA holds that much DHEA. I was able to get 50mg/ml in pure vitamin E that was slightly warmed in hot bath.

My lotioncraft order came late evening yesterday, so I'll be playing with ethyoxydiglycol soon to let you know how it turns out. Haven't done anything with hormones yet, like I said, just got it yesterday. But I did make a simple 2% lidocaine cream out of olive oil, PG, and water. The montanov did a great job with this. Not that thick, maybe like "cake icing" almost.

 

[brightside]

Yeah, the measuring equipment you'd need to make a literal 1ml solution would be so small, lol. Not sure that would be easily found. The smallest measuring beacons I've been able to find is 10ml, which might be useful for this. You could fill it half-way with solvent, it's not like 5mls would be a huge waste if the solution doesn't hold. I wouldn't be surprised though if PG & OA holds that much DHEA. I was able to get 50mg/ml in pure vitamin E that was slightly warmed in hot bath.

My lotioncraft order came late evening yesterday, so I'll be playing with ethyoxydiglycol soon to let you know how it turns out. Haven't done anything with hormones yet, like I said, just got it yesterday. But I did make a simple 2% lidocaine cream out of olive oil, PG, and water. The montanov did a great job with this. Not that thick, maybe like "cake icing" almost.

Well, I had these little plastic tubes for plants around the house, so I used them. Lol Amazon product ASIN B08BZ969DKView: https://www.amazon.com/Plastic-Flowers-Supplies-Arrangements-Decoration/dp/B08BZ969DK

I put a stick through the top and put them into a water bath. Kind of crappy, but it worked. I measured the liquids with 1mL syringes, and the powders with those milligram jewelry scales. So, it was accurate, but there are random factors which are substantial, such as liquid on the walls. Liquid on the walls isn't significant with a 10mL batch, but for 1mL it is. And yeah, 5-10mL isn't too much to waste, but I had to run at least 10 of these tests, so it adds up.

Nice! That's great to hear. How big was your oil phase?

 

[Jessie]

Well, I had these little plastic tubes for plants around the house, so I used them. Lol Amazon product ASIN B08BZ969DKView: https://www.amazon.com/Plastic-Flowers-Supplies-Arrangements-Decoration/dp/B08BZ969DK

I put a stick through the top and put them into a water bath. Kind of crappy, but it worked. I measured the liquids with 1mL syringes, and the powders with those milligram jewelry scales. So, it was accurate, but there are random factors which are substantial, such as liquid on the walls. Liquid on the walls isn't significant with a 10mL batch, but for 1mL it is. And yeah, 5-10mL isn't too much to waste, but I had to run at least 10 of these tests, so it adds up.

Nice! That's great to hear. How big was your oil phase?

Thanks for the tip, I never considered using something like that. Might can give you a rough idea if it's even worth making a bigger batch with the same solvent.

I used 15ml of olive oil. The other part was 7.5ml water and 7.5ml of PG. A little less than 1g of montanov. I spread the size of about a quarter on my forearm and could tell it was working, although kinda weak (only being 2%). Most topical lidocaine formulations are like 4-5%.

 

[brightside]

Thanks for the tip, I never considered using something like that. Might can give you a rough idea if it's even worth making a bigger batch with the same solvent.

Yup, that exactly what I used it for. I tried squalane, and that held basically nothing. Really good to waste only 1mL instead of more.

I used 15ml of olive oil. The other part was 7.5ml water and 7.5ml of PG. A little less than 1g of montanov. I spread the size of about a quarter on my forearm and could tell it was working, although kinda weak (only being 2%). Most topical lidocaine formulations are like 4-5%.

Damn! That's a massive oil phase. And you only used ~3-4% Montanov. Huh, that's impressive. I recommend leaving this batch and not throwing it away. See how long it takes for something to separate.

I got the impression that the larger the oil phase, the thicker the lotion, but I suppose that's only true to a point, after which you need to actually add thickeners like shea butter, stearic acid, or stearyl alcohol.

Can you drop a video of the texture in our (new) chat?