Worse After Antibiotics: Precipitating Endotoxin Release?

PakPik

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I've been reading some doctors saying the same thing: antibiotics can create a powerfully dangerous immune reaction when lots of endotoxin and microbial debris starts piling up from dead bacteria. They said that they recommend taking for example benadryl (which is similar to cyproheaptadine) and/or antileukotrienes and/or anticytokines when taking this antibiotic treatments in order to lessen this immune response, because it can indeed be very harsh on the vascular system and even cause dangerous situations.
 

jaguar43

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It would depend on the antibiotics. Some are safer than others. Penicillin and minocycline are pretty safe.
 
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Parsifal

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I was on amoxicilin when the poisoning happened. Since then I have a lot of varicoceles and very dark circles under the eyes. Some things improve it, like lysine and quinones but I hope I will be able to reverse it someday.
 

FredSonoma

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I've been reading some doctors saying the same thing: antibiotics can create a powerfully dangerous immune reaction when lots of endotoxin and microbial debris starts piling up from dead bacteria. They said that they recommend taking for example benadryl (which is similar to cyproheaptadine) and/or antileukotrienes and/or anticytokines when taking this antibiotic treatments in order to lessen this immune response, because it can indeed be very harsh on the vascular system and even cause dangerous situations.

Not sure if this is possible, but I feel like this happens when I suddenly up the amount of red light I get - flu-like symptoms.
 

Tarmander

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This is a big reason why oral vitamin K causes a pretty bad reaction in me. I get a sore throat, tired, fatigued, and if I keep at it eventually sick.
 
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Not sure if this is possible, but I feel like this happens when I suddenly up the amount of red light I get - flu-like symptoms.

This could be related to some sort of cellular detoxing. I've had the same thing happen....feels like latent infections being stirred up, but then I always emerge feeling stronger.
 

misery guts

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PakPik said:
I've been reading some doctors saying the same thing: antibiotics can create a powerfully dangerous immune reaction when lots of endotoxin and microbial debris starts piling up from dead bacteria. They said that they recommend taking for example benadryl (which is similar to cyproheaptadine) and/or antileukotrienes and/or anticytokines when taking this antibiotic treatments in order to lessen this immune response, because it can indeed be very harsh on the vascular system and even cause dangerous situations.

Would immunosuppressants not be counterproductive in trying to kill off an infection though?

FAQs - Road Back Foundation
This site advocates low dosed "pulsing" antibiotic protocols. Designed to avoid issues like that described in Q20 in the link above, which seems similar to what's described in the OP.
 
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misery guts

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I was on amoxicilin when the poisoning happened. Since then I have a lot of varicoceles and very dark circles under the eyes. Some things improve it, like lysine and quinones but I hope I will be able to reverse it someday.

I'm going to be trying antibiotics soon (for arthritis/depression), and plan on following this supplement regime: Easing mitochondrial stress in chronic Chlamydia pneumoniae infections
Have you tried the things listed there?

This is a big reason why oral vitamin K causes a pretty bad reaction in me. I get a sore throat, tired, fatigued, and if I keep at it eventually sick.

I get this almost constantly, and I think it's generally after I've eaten starch (which presumably produces endotoxin in my gut etc). Do you not take this as a sign to redouble your efforts? For instance starting a full course of antibiotics? Do you know what infection you have?
 

Tarmander

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I'm going to be trying antibiotics soon (for arthritis/depression), and plan on following this supplement regime: Easing mitochondrial stress in chronic Chlamydia pneumoniae infections
Have you tried the things listed there?



I get this almost constantly, and I think it's generally after I've eaten starch (which presumably produces endotoxin in my gut etc). Do you not take this as a sign to redouble your efforts? For instance starting a full course of antibiotics? Do you know what infection you have?

Part of me would like to try and push through, like at a time where work was slow.. But I don't think I will. Without really increasing metabolism, I think it will just come back. I would rather work on other parts of the picture and have the bacterial issue slowly go away then try and carpet bomb them out of existence. I know some people have reported better health after a couple courses of antibiotics, like Danny Roddy getting rid of his milk allergy. Perhaps if I had something specific like that I would be more willing to try it. I just don't want to get in the cycle where I am killing them off, they come back, I kill them off, etc. I am not sure what type of bacteria it is, but they really only bother me when I eat or take certain things.
 
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Parsifal

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Not sure if this is possible, but I feel like this happens when I suddenly up the amount of red light I get - flu-like symptoms.
This is a big reason why oral vitamin K causes a pretty bad reaction in me. I get a sore throat, tired, fatigued, and if I keep at it eventually sick.

Have you tried it with activated charcoal guys to see if it lowers any symptoms?
 

lvysaur

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This is a big reason why oral vitamin K causes a pretty bad reaction in me. I get a sore throat, tired, fatigued, and if I keep at it eventually sick.

What does vitamin K have to do with antibiotics?
 
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Parsifal

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@haidut Do you know if this can happen with other antibiotics like tetracycline? I'm affraid to take antibiotics now (but I have signs of bacterial problems like swollen lymph nodes since 5 years) after what happened to me.
 

TubZy

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This is a big reason why oral vitamin K causes a pretty bad reaction in me. I get a sore throat, tired, fatigued, and if I keep at it eventually sick.

Dude, same with me. 3 days ago I started high dose Vit K (45mg three times a day) for gums and liver and immediately after my first dose I got extremely tired and fatigue like I could barely keep my head up. I thought it was from lack of sugar but it didn't really resolve it. It would happen like that after every dose of K but sometimes would be worse than others. Like today it wasn't as bad. So I have no idea if it's a endotoxin buildup, or my liver dumping PUFA...I think now though it may be endotoxin related possibly from the anatagonism of the TLR4 receptor.

On the plus side my teeth look very healthy and my skin is way smoother since starting K.
 

Tarmander

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Dude, same with me. 3 days ago I started high dose Vit K (45mg three times a day) for gums and liver and immediately after my first dose I got extremely tired and fatigue like I could barely keep my head up. I thought it was from lack of sugar but it didn't really resolve it. It would happen like that after every dose of K but sometimes would be worse than others. Like today it wasn't as bad. So I have no idea if it's a endotoxin buildup, or my liver dumping PUFA...I think now though it may be endotoxin related possibly from the anatagonism of the TLR4 receptor.

On the plus side my teeth look very healthy and my skin is way smoother since starting K.

I think you are right, probably something Endotoxin related. When I wrote the above I had not really gotten into charcoal that heavily. I would be curious if adding charcoal to the mix might make the vitamin K not cause as many issues. Since I have added charcoal to the mix I have not tried vitamin K in the higher doses, maybe something to experiment with.
 
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Parsifal

Parsifal

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Dude, same with me. 3 days ago I started high dose Vit K (45mg three times a day) for gums and liver and immediately after my first dose I got extremely tired and fatigue like I could barely keep my head up. I thought it was from lack of sugar but it didn't really resolve it. It would happen like that after every dose of K but sometimes would be worse than others. Like today it wasn't as bad. So I have no idea if it's a endotoxin buildup, or my liver dumping PUFA...I think now though it may be endotoxin related possibly from the anatagonism of the TLR4 receptor.

On the plus side my teeth look very healthy and my skin is way smoother since starting K.
Have you tried activated charcoal to see if it lower the symptoms?
 

Mauritio

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