Ray Peat Interview #85: Protein Restriction | Lidocaine for Hair Loss? | Brain Size, Intelligence & Symptom Recognition with Georgi and Danny

[JCastro]

Does anyone know how much thyroid does Ray take nowadays?
Perhaps I'm being harsh, the fact that he still needs to use thyroid hormones suggests that his dietary principles never really cure hypothyroidism and that is a sad realization. To think that he's dedicated his whole life to thyroid/ metabolism research and has little to show for.
It's one thing if he'd be using it to get an edge in his old age, but if he's needing it to be functional, that's not good.

Other protocols promise permanent reversal of hypothyroid state, why should I still follow Ray's?

I have suspected for years that Ray has long-term mercury poisoning, with some in his hypothalamus causing chronic thyroid deficiency that he treats exogenously, and mercury would also be a partial explanation for his eccentricity and myriad food sensitivities. He doesn't care about mercury's 24.6-year tissue half-life, and doesn't even think amalgams are a problem. The Andy Cutler paradigm is the only reasonable way to get it out, but Ray is also disinterested in that. I think this could even explain his childhood health issues including the estrogenic symptoms he described like migraines and vision problems.

 

[A.D.]

This seems to correlate with what Christopher Walker says for maximizing Testosterone:

 

[Ritchie]

Just in case anyone was more curious about this part of the interview.

Me: You mentioned you are eating around 500-600 grams of carbohydrates per day, some of which is well cooked vegetables. Do you mean starchy vegetables like potatoes or are you eating lots of the green vegetables like broccoli, kale, etc... I'm super curious where you're getting all that carbohydrate from. Thank you!

Ray: No potatoes; asparagus, turnips, carrots, cauliflower, squash.

I think hes including fiber in his 500 - 600 grams of carbohydrates per day.

In a few other recent interviews he has explicitly said that he is eating potatoes, rice, oats, etc. He’s also recently mentioned that he’s eating broccoli and brussel sprouts as well so it seems the list of veges is growing.

 

[tastyfood]

In a few other recent interviews he has explicitly said that he is eating potatoes, rice, oats, etc. He’s also recently mentioned that he’s eating broccoli and brussel sprouts as well so it seems the list of veges is growing.

Very important to note his comment about introducing some of these foods for variety of taste. It gets really boring to eat the same thing over and over. Routine also increases serotonin.

 

[tastyfood]

This episode made my head spin. Ray is right that it is really hard to eat lower than 50g of protein per day if you eat pro metabolic foods.

Today, my breakfast consisted of: 1/3 cup of oat bran cooked in a cup of milk, one glass orange juice, a cup of coffee with two scoops gelatin. Just with this, I consumed 31g of protein according to Cronometer.

The part about the difficulty of measuring thyroid tables was so new to me. I thought using the scale was enough. It didn't even occur to me that the thyroid content could be unevenly distributed. After all, medications in pill form are sold to consume whole, not in nibbles.

I underestimated how quickly protein intake goes up throughout the day. Cronometer is your best friend for learning what you are eating.

I drank a couple of cups of milk today, ate an egg, 4 scoops of gelatin, and a greek yogurt today as my primary "protein foods". It's 5:30pm and I already have had 100g of protein today between the primary protein foods and a misc of things including juice and veggies. I think I have been overdoing milk from a protein intake point of view.

Anecdotally, bringing the ratio of carbs to protein up the other day made me feel good and kept my temps up.

 

[Richiebogie]

This seems to correlate with what Christopher Walker says for maximizing Testosterone:

Christopher Walker in this video recommends 1/4 of your calories come from animal protein if you are weightlifting.

Ray Peat is on 50g of protein and 500g of carbs. If Peat is not eating any fat then he is getting 1/10 of his calories coming from all protein sources.

Peat currently seems to be more inspired by Durianrider than Christopher Walker, perhaps with extra asparagus!

 

[tokimaturi]

Does anyone know how much thyroid does Ray take nowadays?
Perhaps I'm being harsh, the fact that he still needs to use thyroid hormones suggests that his dietary principles never really cure hypothyroidism and that is a sad realization. To think that he's dedicated his whole life to thyroid/ metabolism research and has little to show for.
It's one thing if he'd be using it to get an edge in his old age, but if he's needing it to be functional, that's not good.

Other protocols promise permanent reversal of hypothyroid state, why should I still follow Ray's?

As you get older, even if you're not hypothyroid, you can still benefit from supplementing. Unless you've found a cure for ageing.

 

[cupofcoffee]

that's it, when NWO hits i'm living on bread and candies!

 

[A.D.]

Christopher Walker in this video recommends 1/4 of your calories come from animal protein if you are weightlifting.

Ray Peat is on 50g of protein and 500g of carbs. If Peat is not eating any fat then he is getting 1/10 of his calories coming from all protein sources.

Peat currently seems to be more inspired by Durianrider than Christopher Walker, perhaps with extra asparagus!

This may be true. Although Ray is speaking on what some can live on, are we still looking to Ray for a diet we can THRIVE on? He now seems to be only providing advice as a remedy for those with metabolic problems rather than someone giving advice on what is MOST optimal. I'm curious what @Hans has to say about all this.

 

[Hans]

This may be true. Although Ray is speaking on what some can live on, are we still looking to Ray for a diet we can THRIVE on? He now seems to be only providing advice as a remedy for those with metabolic problems rather than someone giving advice on what is MOST optimal. I'm curious what @Hans has to say about all this.

In vitro research is nice, but rarely pans out in vivo. A lot of people thrive on a high-protein diet. My advice is to experiment and find what works for you. Obviously, in the context of building muscle and exercise performance and recovery, more protein is likely required.

 

[-Luke-]

All protein sources have some amino acids either missing or in very low amounts.

Many of the foods we advocate, like gelatin, are very low on the less desirable amino acids. Those foods still count as protein. You don't need all amino acids for something to be called protein.

If the goal is methionine/cysteine/tryptophan restriction, gelatin is indeed negligible since it has no cysteine and tryptophan and only small amounts of methionine. And from what I hear from Peat's interviews, this seems to be the main reason for his low protein experiment. So @GreekDemiGod has a point when he asks whether gelatin does "count". I wonder if a diet high in protein but low in methionine/cysteine/tryptophan would still somewhat supress thyroid function. And I'm aware that such a diet does not really occur in reality and is rather a theoretical discussion.

What came to my mind in the last few days is one thing I read about 10 years ago. I was a member of an acne forum and there I came across the work of Ray Peat. A member of the forum did an experiment where for a time he got his protein only from gelatin and a little cheese. If I remember correctly, he came up with something like 80g of protein per day, but I may be wrong. 80g with only small amounts of the three amino acids mentioned above. And he reported that he had a very high libido during that time. I wonder what the mechanism is here.

 

[GreekDemiGod]

In a few other recent interviews he has explicitly said that he is eating potatoes, rice, oats, etc. He’s also recently mentioned that he’s eating broccoli and brussel sprouts as well so it seems the list of veges is growing.

He probably learned to appreciate the slow and steady energy release that glucose offers.

 

[Stilgar]

In a few other recent interviews he has explicitly said that he is eating potatoes, rice, oats, etc. He’s also recently mentioned that he’s eating broccoli and brussel sprouts as well so it seems the list of veges is growing.

I think that was more a description of possible carbohydrate sources that would be safe to eat. He has said multiple times he is allergic to potatoes and doesn't eat them, so would be surprised if he started now.

 

[Goat-e]

As far as I can tell all Peat is doing is ‘perceiving, thinking, and then acting’. His context is changing (increasing age is possibly part of this and there could be other factors too like food availability) and he’s adapting to it, I can’t think of anything more ‘Peatish’. People who want a Guru or just want to be told how to eat without thinking/experimenting for themselves, or need a protocol to follow, will inevitably feel betrayed when what they slavishly took on board from an external ‘authority’ changes.

 

[Sefton10]

People who want a Guru or just want to be told how to eat without thinking/experimenting for themselves, or need a protocol to follow, will inevitably feel betrayed when what they slavishly took on board from an external ‘authority’ changes.

Exactly this. I sense a lot of frustration with Ray in some people recently, even though the “Peat” diet they thought they were doing wasn’t working for them either.

 

[conrad0602]

To be fair he has always made quite a point of vegetables not being an ideal food and having many issues that make them a poor source of nutrition for any human. Both In interviews and in depth articles. I'm getting the impression that a decent portion of his diet now seems to come form vegetables, including above ground cruciferous ones. He knows his advice is heard by and influences many so some explanation for backtracking on the information in "vegetables, who defines food" for example is warranted.

 

[David PS]

It is not labeled as protein restriction, but . . .

A high carbohydrate diet with a low glycaemic index improves training effects in male endurance athletes - PubMed

The present study investigated the effect of a 4-week high fat low carbohydrate (HFLC-G) versus high carbohydrate low glycaemic (LGI-G) or high glycaemic (HGI-G) diet on power output at lactate thresholds, peak oxygen uptake and peak performance during an incremental cycle test in 28 male...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

 

[Inaut]

Ray is 80 years old. I can see why he doesn't feel the need to eat as much protein as before. I like the fact he's always changing his stance on dietary things (like the rest of us humans). I think we(generally speaking) tend to overemphasize everything Ray says and when we hear something contradictory, it causes dissonance.

Peat has really opened my eyes to the metabolic/energy world, avoiding PUFAs (more specifically processed seed oils) and doing less with more (especially supplements). Take what works and leave the rest.

 

[pineywoodrooter]

Ray is 80 years old. I can see why he doesn't feel the need to eat as much protein as before. I like the fact he's always changing his stance on dietary things (like the rest of us humans). I think we(generally speaking) tend to overemphasize everything Ray says and when we hear something contradictory, it causes dissonance.

Peat has really opened my eyes to the metabolic/energy world, avoiding PUFAs (more specifically processed seed oils) and doing less with more (especially supplements). Take what works and leave the rest.

This. It's funny to see these dietary "cults" form. "Peat says eat enough protein!" "Lol you eat vegetables? Must be new here...."

Now Peat drops his protein way down and eats vegetables other than carrot and mushrooms. This isn't a dog on Peat. It's really the fault of some of his followers that treat his words like Gospel and act like parrots.

"Peat says this, Peat says that". Sure. What does your body say though?

 

[Herbie]

He probably listend to @westsidepufas

Lol I was thinking how he would be laughing and rubbing his hands together