Collagen Gelatin and Cravings

[pboy]

So I make sure and know I am getting adequate total protein, and extra choline. I also eat a lot of saturated and monounsaturated fats, and adequate carbohydrate as well as
adequate calcium, magnesium, zinc, copper, selenium, potassium, sodium, chloride, iodine, and vitamin c.

However, I do this on a mostly plant/microbe based diet (I would say all, but incidentally I might happen to have something else in what I eat on very rare occasion, maybe once every few months, for social or just enjoyablity purposes) . I completely agree with most of what Ray peat says, and understand why he eats what he does in the appropriate ratios and the science/sense behind it...I am just currently replacing a few of the main Peat foods with different ones, but in totality, for the same effects and ratios.

The one thing that stands out and occasionally I have cravings for are (never or hardly ever dairy, eggs, steaks, briskets, pork chops, breasts, or any more leaner tougher stuff); but I do crave things like sausage, wiener, ground processed meat, lunch meat...aged sausages and bacons, those little smoked bite sized sausage snack links, brown gravies (probably made with meat stock), organs seem strangely appealing though I have never really eaten them much at all or even know what they taste like, shrimp crab kalimari and lobster (not really clams or other fish), fried chicken, smoked turkey legs, corn dogs ...basically more of the ground, fatty, kid style, possibly or likely containing mostly meat other than the 'lean good' cuts, meat with skins, stuff like that. Could this be related to collagen / gelatin? I'm thinking so because I cant think of any other nutrtient that those particular meats would contain in isolation that something else wouldn't have.

Does this make any sense to you guys...and if so, what would you suggest as the most efficient, potent way to get in the nutrients of particular value that those meats offer so
I can end or drastically limit the cravings...and hopefully feel better and enjoy myself at the same time.

If you're wondering why I don't just eat the meats...its sort of a self experiment I'm not ready to break yet, and may or may not do so depending on how I feel or when I feel like I've completed the experiment enough (It's been quite the journey, from the computer to the kitchen to the bathroom, an every day learning experience, 2+ years). At this point I'm feeling that I should try adding the most potent source of unique collagen containing nutrients, try to control for it as best I can, and see what happens, be it meat or not.

Sorry for the possible inappropriateness of this topic, but I'm serious about figuring things out and really, all in all, I just wanna make my days as easy as possible so I can sleep well and dream pleasantly at night.

 

[Mephisto]

Processed meats also tend to have a lot of salt, so could it be that too?

 

[Jenn]

Processed meat craving can be minerals,protein, salt cravings. Processed meats can be easier to digest (meaning break down easier in the stomach because they are pre chewed, sort of). Gelatin can be easier to digest. Processed meats do NOT necessarily contain any gelatin (collegen).

Keep in mind, just because there is a nutrient listed on a label, doesn't mean the body knows how to use it.

Can I ask what you are actually eating? I lived for a long time on potatoes because they contain high quality protein. There are not a whole lot of other plant based proteins that have the same characteristics that are beneficial.

 

[pboy]

Processed meat craving can be minerals,protein, salt cravings. Processed meats can be easier to digest (meaning break down easier in the stomach because they are pre chewed, sort of). Gelatin can be easier to digest. Processed meats do NOT necessarily contain any gelatin (collegen).

Keep in mind, just because there is a nutrient listed on a label, doesn't mean the body knows how to use it.

Can I ask what you are actually eating? I lived for a long time on potatoes because they contain high quality protein. There are not a whole lot of other plant based proteins that have the same characteristics that are beneficial.

Im thinking you have a lot of good points and they parallel what I kinda thought....although getting adequate protein on paper, I'm finding that getting more is helping in some way and I'm generally feeling better...but also, though I cant make sense of it, there is something about the eating of salt/umami(brothy savory)/protein combo at the same time that seems to be what satisfies and satiates me...whereas if I was to just have salt water alone or salted coffee or just a relatively plain protein source alone...it doesn't seem to do much. Thanks for the tips and insights guys...also Jenn I think since having not been eating much if any meat for the past while my digestive enzymes for breaking it down are probably pretty weak...which maybe why I crave the preground / softer types, makes sense


I basically make a thick soup/broth each morning with various seaweeds, herbs, mushrooms, wheatgrass juice, algae, brazil nut on occasion, and plenty of salt and a little oil (usually coconut). I strain out some of the ingredients after it cooks and leave mostly just the juices. It covers most of what I would need to make up any mineral / nutrient that I wouldn't get from the rest of the stuff I eat during the day (Basically it replaces the milk / organs / gelatin / shellfish needs of the Peat diet, though many here would consider those foods that I eat to have irritating compounds in them so I cant recommend them). Throughout the day its mostly fruit, fruit juice, chocolate, coffee, coconut oil, sometimes other teas/herbals, occasional macadamia nuts or cashews (Totaling on average about 40g protein a day, which I'm starting to think may be the main culprit behind the cravings)

 

[Jenn]

Not enough protein...I've been there, done that. Yes, it is good to get a little protein and a little carb at each meal or snack. Mushrooms are a good protein, but not complete like a potato. They do not contain any cellulose, which is a good thing. Nuts are not a good source of protein, they are actually high in nitrogen, not real protein. (Nitrogen is a component of proteins, so sometime they test for nitrogen and call it good. That is how melamine was able to be used in foods because it tests high in nitrogen.) Think of them as a starch and a source of PUFAS.

Seaweed is not the best source of minerals for a human. I feed it to my ruminants all the time though. Unrefined sea salt is better, you want ionic, not colloidal.

Sometimes when you start adding protein back into the diet, the kidneys don't keep up well. Gelatin as jello, meaning in the gelled and chilled form can be easier on the kidneys than gelatin in liquid form as in hot coffee.

As a recovering vegan, I would highly recommend a potato based diet for healing purposes. It works.

Here's a list of the variety of potato based dishes I came up with during my journey:
http://losingcreekfarm.blogspot.com/p/t ... -page.html

 

[kiran]

Here's a list of the variety of potato based dishes I came up with during my journey:
http://losingcreekfarm.blogspot.com/p/t ... -page.html

Hash Brown recipe gone missing?

 

[Jenn]

Oh, hash browns....

Heat a generous amount of coconut oil in WIDE pan. Peel potato, and shred on the short side of the potato. Drain any excess liquid. When oil is hot, sprinkle shreds into pan to cover. Not too thick or potatoes will steam and get mushy. When crisp, flip over in large chunks. Crisp again. Check for done ness in the middle. Salt generously and enjoy! Don't forget to chew, chew, chew, conversion of starch into glucose begins in the mouth.

Hash browns would not be my first recommendation for someone with digestive issues, but they sure are yummy.

 

[kiran]

Btw, to make hash browns light and fluffy, you can add some chili powder and then drain the resulting liquid and rinse it. I think that gets rid of some of the starch, and stops it from being gummy.

 

[Jenn]

Rinsing does that, not the chili powder. I don't have the patience for rinsing. My hash browns aren't gummy...I am very generous with the coconut oil. I just want to eat!

 

[kiran]

Rinsing does that, not the chili powder. I don't have the patience for rinsing. My hash browns aren't gummy...I am very generous with the coconut oil. I just want to eat!

I've experimented with rinsing it first, but adding chili powder will make the potato release more gooey liquid.

 

[Jenn]

Does your chili powder have salt in it?

 

[kiran]

No. I added salt first and that didn't seem to make that much of a difference. It was the combo maybe. I'll keep a closer eye next time.

 

[Jenn]

Now I am going to have to experiment. Chili powder is useful for a lot of things and is anti inflammatory, but I don't know why. Perhaps it is a diuretic of some kind too?

 

[kiran]

It's a vasodilator.

Apparently it can counteract starch in some ways, possibly the vasodilation improves blood flow through starch clogged blood vessels?
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1 ... x/abstract