Complete Menopausal Peat

[HDD]

I also believe many health problems are connected. Some of that comes from seeing how many diseases or illnesses occur more frequently in women. There is often a hormone connection, imo, even in an illness that one usually wouldn't think to find one.

I've also had experience with doctors wanting to cut things out or prescribe pills and never being told WHY I have this or that. They seem genuinely amused when you want to know what caused it or how can it be healed (instead of removing organ or masking symptoms).

And unfortunately if they make the hormone connection, they get it wrong-

"The strong association of MS with estrogen has led to an illogical, but popular and well-publicized medical conclusion that estrogen is protective against MS, and some have claimed that estrogen has beneficial therapeutic effects. This strange way of thinking has its equivalent in the idea that, since women are much more likely than men to develop Alzheimer's disease, estrogen is protective against it; or that, since women have more fragile bones than men do, and their progressive bone loss occurs during the times of their greatest exposure to estrogen, estrogen prevents osteoporosis.
In this medical environment, close associations between estrogen and degenerative diseases are acknowledged, but they are given a meaning contrary to common sense by saying that the association occurs because there isn't enough estrogen. The stove burns you because it isn't hot enough."
http://raypeat.com/articles/articles/ms.shtml

 

[Peata]

Yes, it's almost worse when they see a connection but treat it with more estrogen. At my last checkup I told my gyn. about my estrogen dominance problems and she said the only thing she could do is put me back on the pill.

She was however, quite agreeable when I told her I'd like to try progesterone cream instead (this was just before I found Peat).

 

[messtafarian]

Well I screwed up my own hormones through an almost terrifying lack of education. My grandma died in 1989 at the age of 83 -- I should have just eaten like she did all along. She didn't have any fibroids; but her daughters did. This is how dumb I am -- I was thinking the reason I had so many uterine issues is because *it was genetic*. And the treatment for this was to give myself brain damage with iron and wait for my ovaries to "run out of eggs." Unless I wanted to go under general anesthesia and get it all cut out of me.

You know? It's the 21st century, this is what's happening here.

On another note though -- regarding fibroids, something dawned on me through the back end of researching vitamin K2: one thing the internet is selling lately as a miracle cure for fibroids is something called "nattokinase" -- they call it an "anti-fibrin agent". it's an extract of fermented natto, which is exactly what they get K2 MK-7 out of. I never made the connection between K2, calcium, heart problems and fibrosis until I had ordered a 50 dollar bottle of this stuff and thrown it out thinking it did nothing and it was just more junk I shouldn't have bought off of the internet.

I'm taking K2 now for blood pressure as suggested by RP -- but I'm thinking it might help with fibroids too; along with progesterone, aspirin, vitamin e and coconut oil. K2's been tested at massive doses -- can't hurt to try it.

 

[Swandattur]

Here is an interesting article by a veterinarian that in many ways goes along with Peat ideas on this subject: http://www.drplechner.com/compendiumpdfs/elestrogen.pdf

 

[j.]

it's an extract of fermented natto, which is exactly what they get K2 MK-7 out of. I never made the connection between K2, calcium, heart problems and fibrosis until I had ordered a 50 dollar bottle of this stuff and thrown it out thinking it did nothing and it was just more junk I shouldn't have bought off of the internet.

I actually think throwing it out was the right thing to do. I believe MK4 to be safer than MK7 because there are many more high dose experiments, I think even up to 135 mg per day, where it produced no harm.

 

[messtafarian]

Yeah, especially since who knows what else was in those pills. I think I read that the reason MK-7 gives people issues is that it can convert to K1; so there's a blood-thinning action that won't occur with MK-4.

 

[Swandattur]

What about the K in grass fed ghee?

 

[j.]

What about the K in grass fed ghee?

I think that's K2 of the form MK4, though the amounts varies wildly if I recall correctly.

 

[Swandattur]

Thanks. It seems like it would be a safe form since it is the natural cow product.

 

[j.]

Thanks. It seems like it would be a safe form since it is the natural cow product.

It's about the only natural source, organs (pancreas, tongue, and others) are the only other source I can think of.

 

[messtafarian]

In other news...

My fingernails are back. A couple months ago they were like onionskin paper and shredded down so far that my fingertips ached.

They're back. A litle soft, but no shredding and not too many ridges.

I'm really glad, that was really worrying me.

 

[Swandattur]

Fingernails coming back seems a very good sign! You know you must be doing something right, then.

 

[Kray]

Messtafarian: (Part of) your entry from Sept 2013:

"Other supplements:

Aspirin without fail.
B12 and folate every three days ( I need to supplement this but B12 can raise untreated blood pressure so I'm holding back on dosing liberally until it improves)
Pregnenolone 30mg every three days
Progesterone on cycle. I am trying a weeklong break since the breast tenderness and stomach discomfort was slowly driving me insane. I'm also kind of wondering if I'll get a period. I'd be kind of glad to see it, if I did.

I am still unable to tolerate very much gelatin. I keep trying - this week I plan on making bone broth and a brisket to increase all protein including gelatin. For a couple days now my protein has been about 30 grams a day. I have never done a food diary with the level of micronutrient calculation that Cronometer has. Without wheat and soy, I just have almost no protein in my diet and now that I think of it it's probably been pretty low for years."

After reading your entry about taking pregnenolone 30 mg every 3 days, I wondered how did you come to the decision to take it intermittently, vs. daily? I have read about cycling it for 3 weeks and one week off, but not this. How does one really decide if they need pregnenolone at all, especially if their thyroid is where it should be? Hasn't Peat said that you may not need to keep taking pregnenolone, progesterone, etc, as well as thyroid, if you get your body into a good state of health? Just wondering. Thanks.

 

[Kray]

The pregnenolone looks good. I happen to take Swanson 10 mg.

Hi J- I found this thread looking for menopause help. I've taken the Swanson too. I do like that it has virtually no fillers.

Question- do you still take the pregn at that dose, same brand? I can't quite figure out what/how I should be supplementing the progest-pregn combo. Do you have any nuggets of wisdom here? I'm late 50's, menopause, all body parts intact. I probably am doing either or both at any given time for "anti-aging" factors, a la Peat, otherwise no screaming reason. Any thoughts, feedback, many thanks!

 

[j.]

classicallady, there are really no studies I think about what's the optimal dose. I just really go by feel, some days I feel like taking 10 mg, some days 100 mg. The more stress I've been having, the more I take.

 

[Kray]

classicallady, there are really no studies I think about what's the optimal dose. I just really go by feel, some days I feel like taking 10 mg, some days 100 mg. The more stress I've been having, the more I take.

That's good to know and makes sense-- stress as an indicator. I guess my confusion is not understanding what (too much) pregnenolone can do if you're already in a stressful situation-- does it lend itself even more to estrogen and cortisol vs. progesterone, for example. Am I going to turn it into androgenic/stress hormones, or will my body "automatically" read what it needs from the raw material via pregnenolone? Is it a scientific fact that pregnenolone will do the "good" things in balancing hormones, and will not cause any negative effects if you take more than you need? Sorry if this isn't more clear, but I hope you get my question. :)

 

[Blossom]

classicallady, there are really no studies I think about what's the optimal dose. I just really go by feel, some days I feel like taking 10 mg, some days 100 mg. The more stress I've been having, the more I take.

That's good to know and makes sense-- stress as an indicator. I guess my confusion is not understanding what (too much) pregnenolone can do if you're already in a stressful situation-- does it lend itself even more to estrogen and cortisol vs. progesterone, for example. Am I going to turn it into androgenic/stress hormones, or will my body "automatically" read what it needs from the raw material via pregnenolone? Is it a scientific fact that pregnenolone will do the "good" things in balancing hormones, and will not cause any negative effects if you take more than you need? Sorry if this isn't more clear, but I hope you get my question. :)

Ray Peat has said that pregnenolone is safe at ANY dose. Once I took 675mg and did end up taking a nice long nap so I'm thinking much of it converted to progesterone and gave me an anesthesia response. I just thought I'd share that experience.

 

[j.]

Is it a scientific fact that pregnenolone will do the "good" things in balancing hormones, and will not cause any negative effects if you take more than you need? Sorry if this isn't more clear, but I hope you get my question. :)

The thing about "scientific fact" in medicine is that many recommendations were made over the years based on "scientific facts", but then they were overruled based on "scientific facts", and a few years later the new recommendations were considered wrong again.

Medicine, in many areas, simply doesn't achieve that level of certainty.

The studies that have been done say that the body knows what to do with pregnenolone. In experiments with rats, they gave them a much pregnenolone as possible, literally, as they filled their stomachs with pregnenolone, and noted no negative effects. So the studies suggest it is safe at any dose.

However, I occasionaly read of people who for example get unwanted facial hair (females). So while it benefits many people, the scientific studies might not paint an absolutely complete picture about what we could expect from pregnenolone in every situation.

Peat used 1 gram regularly without noticing problems. I used up to 1.5 grams as a single dose, and I seem to have only benefited from it.

 

[Kray]

Thanks for your comments. I may be one of those women with the facial hair effect, although who's to say I wouldn't have it anyway? But, if it can be a side effect I wonder what that means-- that I needed some male hormones? :) I guess the stress relief is the basic guideline perhaps, as to how much, and from that standpoint, it makes sense to start at a lower dose to better gauge benefits. I know the 100mg is not something I am comfortable taking, so I'll break up a capsule and take maybe 1/3 every 2-3 days.

 

[j.]

I'm not sure that it's good to start at a lower dose. Progesterone in some people creates problems at low doses. I think what happens is that progesterone makes you more sensitive to estrogen. And if you take too little progesterone, it might be enough to make you more sensitive to estrogen but not enough to antagonize it.

Since pregnenolone is a precursor of progesterone, it could have the same effect. It could increase progesterone enough to increase sensitivity to estrogen, meaning that estrogen has a stronger effect, but not enough to antagonize it.

Peat says 100 mg is a good starting dose, and that some people need as much as 1 gram to have a positive effect.