Gaining Muscle Olympic Weightlifting With Peat-style Nutrition

[Zachs]

Vos, thanks! Yea my version of a RP diet did wonders for me. I also utilize Muscle Control for LBM instead of traditional weight training.

Is there anything you can share about your version of an RP diet, or Muscle Control? I love to learn new things!

Same here, i will look into uncoupling when i have some time to commit!

I made a post about MC, here viewtopic.php?f=10&t=5366&p=66378#p66378 and i would be happy to talk more about it over there. Ill write part 2 when i have some time.

My version evolved out of a long stint of VLC that almost killed me, i found Matt Stone, Ray Pear, Roddy and even Durian Rider and expermineted with a lot of stuff from those guys and others. The current version is a very high carb, very low fat and adequate protein diet with occasional fat refeeds. I eat very basic most days, staples are skim milk, bananas and sweet potatoes. I supplement with gelatin, salt, sugar and zinc, magnesium, and a b complex. Other foods i eat are oranges and orange juice, eggs, coffee CO, cheese, oysters. Once a week or so ill eat whatever i want but always watch the PUFA. 500-800g cho, 10-30g fat and 150~ pro.

Thats the basics. I found foods that digested perfectly for me and stuck to that. vLC destroyed my digestive system and i had crazy inflammation from endotoxins. Once i controlled that and brought fat down to bare minimum i lost fat extremely fast. Went from 210 to 168 in a summer. 3-4 months. I also did no exercise during that time. MC was my only formal exercise. Simce then i have remained steady at 170 and kept the same mass with only very minimal MC. Im currently in another phase of fat loss started monday of this week and im doing MC daily with purpose.

 

[Jennifer]

I saw the post on your diet a while back, Zach and just went to link it here, but you beat me to it. :)

I share the same experience with losing weight fast on high carb raw vegan (30 bad style). My first year doing the diet, I ate potatoes, sweet potatoes, squash, rice and oatmeal while transitioning to fully raw, along with raw fruit and tender leafy greens and I was dropping weight/muscle fast on 3000 calories. Back then, Freelee and Harley were against cooked starches. They eventually got over that after realizing how hard it is to find enough ripe raw fruit.

There's also another member on here who was doing a high carb vegan diet. He was eating a lot of potatoes as a protein source and said he went from being obese to fit in two months(?). I honestly think that for a lot of people, despite carbs supposedly sparing protein, it's a diet where you waste away unless you keep upping the calories, which is unbelievably hard to do on low/no fat whole food sources with all that fiber. That's why my gut is a mess now. I needed to add some animal protein back and that's how I went from 70 pounds to 95 pounds of mostly muscle.

Edit - Here's a link to the other member (tca300) I was talking about. I think I chatted with him on a thread not that long ago and he's eating meat again.

viewtopic.php?f=56&t=4966&p=58289&hilit=Dutchie#p58289

 

[cantstoppeating]

For reference, her i am at 170~ and MAYBE 10% bf (probably closer to 12). Im 6'0 tall so to be 175 and under 10%, one would need to see visable 6 pack and straitions in muscle or be really tall, 6,3+.

I eat between 3-4k on any given day which i think is optimal for most males not doing any real exercise.

You look great Zachs. This is what I'd expect to see for your stats. You've made me motivated to continue Peating and tweaking until I have a similar look. 

See guys, look how much one picture says. A picture truly is worth a thousand words.

 

[visionofstrength]

For reference, her i am at 170~ and MAYBE 10% bf (probably closer to 12). Im 6'0 tall so to be 175 and under 10%, one would need to see visable 6 pack and straitions in muscle or be really tall, 6,3+.

I eat between 3-4k on any given day which i think is optimal for most males not doing any real exercise.

You look great Zachs. This is what I'd expect to see for your stats. You've made me motivated to continue Peating and tweaking until I have a similar look. 

See guys, look how much one picture says. A picture truly is worth a thousand words.

You know aquaman will ask Zach for a pic at 210. He wanted one of me at 145!

It would make for nice bookends. Zach starting at 210 and going to 170; me starting at 145 and going to 175. Both on the very same food and supplements! (no bananas for me).

I'm going to ask around and see if anybody has one of me from early last year.

 

[Zachs]

For reference, her i am at 170~ and MAYBE 10% bf (probably closer to 12). Im 6'0 tall so to be 175 and under 10%, one would need to see visable 6 pack and straitions in muscle or be really tall, 6,3+.

I eat between 3-4k on any given day which i think is optimal for most males not doing any real exercise.

You look great Zachs. This is what I'd expect to see for your stats. You've made me motivated to continue Peating and tweaking until I have a similar look. 

See guys, look how much one picture says. A picture truly is worth a thousand words.

Thanks man!

 

[superhuman]

For reference, her i am at 170~ and MAYBE 10% bf (probably closer to 12). Im 6'0 tall so to be 175 and under 10%, one would need to see visable 6 pack and straitions in muscle or be really tall, 6,3+.

I eat between 3-4k on any given day which i think is optimal for most males not doing any real exercise.

looking good bro.

Could you post a daily menu of food and supplement on average?

Also did you work your way up to that amount of calories aka increasing metabolism?

Did you loose fat during the process and did you then eat less cals?

What has gotten you to eat that many cals and stay lean you think? any cliffs you noticed along the way that really impacted your metabolism etc.

Thanx

 

[Zachs]

Thanks!
My ideal day looks like this. When i start to get hungry/thirsty, Drink 16-32oz OJ w added salt, gelatin/glycine, creatine. Take some magnesium and zinc. First meal around 2 hours after waking. Usually a lb of baked/steamed sweet potatoes w CO, maple syrup amd salt. 32oz milk w gelatin. Take some selenium, b complex. Mid day, 4-6 bananas and 32oz milk w gelatin. Afternoon snack, 16oz OJ, 2 hard boiled eggs w salt. Take some D and E. dinner, same as breakfast without supps. Before bed 2-4 bananas w a 6oz milk w maple syrup and glycine.

Thats never the same but that is what i shoot for.

Calories had little to do with fat loss. Dietary fat % was everything.

No i stayed above 3k ever since my stint of VLC and VL calorie almost killed me.

Keeping fat low keeps me lean. I have tried adding in lots of dairy and chocolate fat and eggs and i start adding bodyfat. Also muscle though.

Not sure what you mean by cliffs. I think finding what works for you and staying consistent long enough to permanently inprove metabolism and thyroid health is key.

 

[superhuman]

Thanks!
My ideal day looks like this. When i start to get hungry/thirsty, Drink 16-32oz OJ w added salt, gelatin/glycine, creatine. Take some magnesium and zinc. First meal around 2 hours after waking. Usually a lb of baked/steamed sweet potatoes w CO, maple syrup amd salt. 32oz milk w gelatin. Take some selenium, b complex. Mid day, 4-6 bananas and 32oz milk w gelatin. Afternoon snack, 16oz OJ, 2 hard boiled eggs w salt. Take some D and E. dinner, same as breakfast without supps. Before bed 2-4 bananas w a 6oz milk w maple syrup and glycine.

Thats never the same but that is what i shoot for.

Calories had little to do with fat loss. Dietary fat % was everything.

No i stayed above 3k ever since my stint of VLC and VL calorie almost killed me.

Keeping fat low keeps me lean. I have tried adding in lots of dairy and chocolate fat and eggs and i start adding bodyfat. Also muscle though.

Not sure what you mean by cliffs. I think finding what works for you and staying consistent long enough to permanently inprove metabolism and thyroid health is key.

Cool, thanx alot Zach.

When you increased dietary fat, did you eat the same amount of calories then or did you just add it on top? wich in that case you added alot more calories wich would make you gain weight :P

Do you have any cravings for foods esp those that contain more fatty things? like i love chocolate, cheese even low fat cheese and stuff like that. All have a good amount of fat tho. And also i love food and like to chew it and eat it, i feel milk is like just drinking water. Gives me calories but does not fill me up or i dont like love it.

Cliffs i ment like things you noticed along the way that was key for you in terms of recover and improving things. Like supplements? foods? etc

When you say low fat. What do you consider to be the highest one can go and still you feel the low fat benefits?

 

[Zachs]

No i usually replace a good amount of starch with fat if i do more fat. I get full fast when im eating ice cream and chocolate and whatnot. My body just wants to store fat i guess.

Yes i have cravings and will usually indulge in them. I just try to stay on track most days because i know what feeling less then optimal feels like and i dont like it. Once a week or something i will eat a bunch of pizza or whatever. I try to disconnect myself from food=enjoyment type mentality, although the foods i eat i certainly enjoy! This diet compared to my old diet of bloody rare meat and a pile of veggies... Ill take milk, fruit and sugar any day.

No, just slow and steady improvement. Actually i think the rapid fat loss really helped improve overall health. It was like a purge of toxins, PUFA and estrogen. Now that im leaner i feel much more resilient. Supplements, most i cant tell if they do anything. Thats why i gave up on preg, dhea, aspirin, etc. i keep it simple with some added minerals and vitamins. Since im pretty much vegetarian, i do supplement creatine and find it helps with muscle size. I just started tourine as well. Glycine/geletin for me was huge in removing my inflammation. Others have issues with it but i never did.

I dont think above 30g fat would constitute a very low fat diet and its what i reccomend for anyone looking to drop fat, improve insulin sensitivity, heal leaky gut/endotoxin issues. 50g might be ok if one is doing strenous activity. I think a fat refeed day is a better option then eating fat at every meal. I am not a believer in the whol saturated fat and cholesterol = testosterone. I found it to be just the opposite.

 

[superhuman]

Understand.

I really want to start the less then 30g fat route but i feel its hard since i need like 200g protein a day and if i dont drink skimmed milk i cant achieve that. And also if i use skimmed milk for that, that is all im able to eat wich sux ****
There arent many fat free good peaty protein sources.

When you say inflammation? what did you have?

 

[Zachs]

Protein is hard to get unless you use a lot of gelatin. You could get a whey isolate and casein blend protein powder to supplement. Its not the best but better then a lot of meat, imo.

I got some sort of ulcerative colitis/ibs of some kind from the VLC diet. It felt like it burned a hole through my intestines. I had chronic systemic inflammation of all joints and vertabre, couldnt run, hurt to lay down sometimes. Also had to pee quite a bit at night but little came out, gained fat easily on low calorie diet, etc. also vascular inflammation, heavy heartbeat, anxiety, light headedness.

 

[superhuman]

jeez, that sux.

Yeah but it seems strange that i need that much protein, even RP says that 150g should be enough.

But i need to smack down 200+ to really improve my water retention and stuff.

 

[SQu]

I dont know if pannacotta is possible for someone trying to keep fat to about 20g a day including the 3 tsp CO. I tried with fat free milk - got the gelatin and sugar right but with so little fat it was horrible. For the 23% fat they say is ideal I could use all my daily CO and get about 15g in 100g of pannacotta. But that's so little gelatin and milk its not worth it plus it might not set nicely. anyone found a way?

 

[cout12]

So is it theoretically better to do the same workout in 10-15mins (similarly to crossfit) and be extremely tried afterwards for a short while, or is it better to do that same work out over the course of 1h-1h30 and not be very tired doing it?

 

[aquaman]

I got some sort of ulcerative colitis/ibs of some kind from the VLC diet. It felt like it burned a hole through my intestines. I had chronic systemic inflammation of all joints and vertabre, couldnt run, hurt to lay down sometimes. Also had to pee quite a bit at night but little came out, gained fat easily on low calorie diet, etc. also vascular inflammation, heavy heartbeat, anxiety, light headedness.

Awesome you sorted it out!

I still have these issues from VLC/Paleo days too, but only on digesiton.

 

[aquaman]

So is it theoretically better to do the same workout in 10-15mins (similarly to crossfit) and be extremely tried afterwards for a short while, or is it better to do that same work out over the course of 1h-1h30 and not be very tired doing it?

I think the aim according to the Doc is to not build up lactic acid. He refers to exercise somewhere (anyone know where??), mentioning doing a few push-ups or squats with 5 pound dumbells a few times a day - from memory.

The crossfit way would build up tons of lactic acid and be too stressful. Better to take 2-3 minute rests between sets I think, breathe through the nose calmly. Doing 1 minute work sets plus 2-3 minute rests, you can do 9 sets (3 exercises x 3 sets) in about 40 minutes.

Strangely, I find smiling through the workout helps! It's easy to get all contorted in the face, and shout and grunt and not breathe.

 

[Zachs]

I dont know if pannacotta is possible for someone trying to keep fat to about 20g a day including the 3 tsp CO. I tried with fat free milk - got the gelatin and sugar right but with so little fat it was horrible. For the 23% fat they say is ideal I could use all my daily CO and get about 15g in 100g of pannacotta. But that's so little gelatin and milk its not worth it plus it might not set nicely. anyone found a way?

Imo, coconut oil is kind of a free pass fat since MCT gets metabolized differently. I would say not to worry so much about CO intake and just mainly watch the other fats. Not saying CO is a free for all food though since its just as calorie dense as other fats.

 

[Zachs]

Thanks, aquaman! Its insane how many people get completely messed up from a paleo diet and yet its still gaining momentum. Kind of like crossfit..

So is it theoretically better to do the same workout in 10-15mins (similarly to crossfit) and be extremely tried afterwards for a short while, or is it better to do that same work out over the course of 1h-1h30 and not be very tired doing it?

I think unless your goal is to be a marine, swat team member, MMA fighter or to win the crossfit games, crossfit is an absolute no. It is extremely stressful on the body and your endocrine system will surely suffer.

The best way to build strength without fatigue and lactic build up would be to space workouts over the course of a few hours or even the day. Do lots of sets with heavy weights, low reps and long breaks in between. Also look into Maxalding/muscle control for muscle size. Light runs are a good way to get some exercise as well. Just only breath through the nose and stop when you feel the need to breath through mouth.

 

[cantstoppeating]

I dont know if pannacotta is possible for someone trying to keep fat to about 20g a day including the 3 tsp CO. I tried with fat free milk - got the gelatin and sugar right but with so little fat it was horrible. For the 23% fat they say is ideal I could use all my daily CO and get about 15g in 100g of pannacotta. But that's so little gelatin and milk its not worth it plus it might not set nicely. anyone found a way?

Yes, get yourself casein protein powder and make sure the tryptophan content is less than 2.1g per 100g.

Then use additional Branch Chain Amino Acids (BCAA) at the same time as casein to block absorption of tryptophan.

You can read more about it here:
http://www.raypeatforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=2449&hilit=bcaa+tryptophan

 

[cantstoppeating]

For reference, her i am at 170~ and MAYBE 10% bf (probably closer to 12). Im 6'0 tall so to be 175 and under 10%, one would need to see visable 6 pack and straitions in muscle or be really tall, 6,3+.

I eat between 3-4k on any given day which i think is optimal for most males not doing any real exercise.

You look great Zachs. This is what I'd expect to see for your stats. You've made me motivated to continue Peating and tweaking until I have a similar look. 

See guys, look how much one picture says. A picture truly is worth a thousand words.

You know aquaman will ask Zach for a pic at 210. He wanted one of me at 145!

It would make for nice bookends. Zach starting at 210 and going to 170; me starting at 145 and going to 175. Both on the very same food and supplements! (no bananas for me).

I'm going to ask around and see if anybody has one of me from early last year.