I get jitters from coffee but not from equivalent dose of caffeine, what's going on?

[RealNeat]

Ive noticed that coffee of various brands and origins gives me jitters, stuffy nose, strong coffee smelling urine, more peeing etc

But it seems energy drinks with the same dose of caffeine does not.

Some theories i have to why:

The oils in coffee irritate my gut?
Coffee has mold toxins?
Coffee is too acidic?
Coffee has PAHs, which i react to in other contexts where i am exposed to them?
Coffee stimulates the cortisol response stronger than isolated caffeine?

Anyone share the same thing/ have an explanation?

Btw i love coffee and want to consume it but just dont feel right enough to do it regularly.

 

[RealNeat]

Also ive seen that coffee and or caffeine depletes thiamine, why im not sure and im not about to google it.

 

[charlie]

Because coffee is toxic. Anything that is bitter is toxic to the liver and you.

 

[Jonk]

I read that niacinamide can make you tolerate caffeine better. Not sure if it's the same for niacin which I'm guessing is often used in energy drinks. In one of Rays articles he also mentions how hot drinks can produce hot flashes, not related but maybe might be an experiment to see if it's the same effect hot or cold.

 

[ThinPicking]

Good day Mr RealNeat.

Energy drinks are almost always quite a "thick" hypertonic concoction. Are you drinking the coffee straight or dissolving anything else into it?

If it's just black coffee and nothing else. You could try sipping through it slowly, minding the amount you swallow each time. Sip size to about half your tongue size. Or thicken it up with milk, sugar, honey and/or maple syrup.

Assuming your diet's otherwise rich and feeding's regular, it's probably that simple.

 

[lvysaur]

Ive noticed that coffee of various brands and origins gives me jitters, stuffy nose, strong coffee smelling urine, more peeing etc

But it seems energy drinks with the same dose of caffeine does not.

Coffee is not caffeine, and causes symptoms like:
- needing to defecate
- ocular pressure
- extreme alertness
...among others. Caffeine doesn't cause these (the alertness from caffeine is much milder)
and yes decaf coffee causes these things as well, for me and multiple others I've spoken

Homocysteine is a large part of it, coffee is known to increase it (this is bad).
Coffee also causes Rouleaux stacks, an inflammatory blood cell arrangement (see my old thread below)

Guy Sees His RBCs Under Microscope After Coffee

His blood forms a rouleaux stack after coffee, and it starts to look better after he drinks water and "kangen" water. Though the latter could simply be due to the increased time passing after the coffee.

raypeatforum.com

As always individual results vary, and many people seem to do well on coffee

 

[TucsonJJ]

I get heart palps from coffee... bummer, as I really like it. Mexicola gives much lower effects, even regular store Coke does too.

I think coffee may trigger histamine and I am sensitive to that. Theanine can mellow out, but not eliminate the coffee palps... ditto D-Ribose.

 

[RealNeat]

Because coffee is toxic. Anything that is bitter is toxic to the liver and you.

Where are you getting this? Bitters have been used as a digestive aid for a very long time and how do you explain the myriad of studies showing coffee to be beneficial to the liver? As you know this is not a common opinion here so curious as to your view.

 

[RealNeat]

I get heart palps from coffee... bummer, as I really like it. Mexicola gives much lower effects, even regular store Coke does too.

I think coffee may trigger histamine and I am sensitive to that. Theanine can mellow out, but not eliminate the coffee palps... ditto D-Ribose.

Id say sometimes I get the same thing from black tea but that could be a tannin or histamine thing too

 

[RealNeat]

Good day Mr RealNeat.

Energy drinks are almost always quite a "thick" hypertonic concoction. Are you drinking the coffee straight or dissolving anything else into it?

If it's just black coffee and nothing else. You could try sipping through it slowly, minding the amount you swallow each time. Sip size to about half your tongue size. Or thicken it up with milk, sugar, honey and/or maple syrup.

Assuming your diet's otherwise rich and feeding's regular, it's probably that simple.

I've tried it a million and one ways. None of that works to eliminate all of the symptoms I get from it.

 

[RealNeat]

I read that niacinamide can make you tolerate caffeine better. Not sure if it's the same for niacin which I'm guessing is often used in energy drinks. In one of Rays articles he also mentions how hot drinks can produce hot flashes, not related but maybe might be an experiment to see if it's the same effect hot or cold.

Hot or cold doesn't really matter for me, I have had plain caffeine with nothing added and no similar symptoms to coffee.

 

[RealNeat]

Coffee is not caffeine, and causes symptoms like:
- needing to defecate
- ocular pressure
- extreme alertness
...among others. Caffeine doesn't cause these (the alertness from caffeine is much milder)
and yes decaf coffee causes these things as well, for me and multiple others I've spoken

Homocysteine is a large part of it, coffee is known to increase it (this is bad).
Coffee also causes Rouleaux stacks, an inflammatory blood cell arrangement (see my old thread below)

Guy Sees His RBCs Under Microscope After Coffee

His blood forms a rouleaux stack after coffee, and it starts to look better after he drinks water and "kangen" water. Though the latter could simply be due to the increased time passing after the coffee.

raypeatforum.com

As always individual results vary, and many people seem to do well on coffee

The homocysteine angle is curious, I'll dig in to it. I'm guessing it's more taxing to the body to keep up with increased energy demands with coffee than caffeine, it may be more metabolism boosting that plain caffeine. Also the blood thickening is probably due to the acclimation period to the diuretic effects. Acute and chronic caffeine/ coffee use seem to be two different worlds.

 

[Korven]

I also feel better with caffeine pills, gives me a nice warm buzz. Coffee makes me "high", sort of unpleasant really.

Coffee is an alkaloid soup with unpredictable effects on physiology. It is also very gut irritating.

 

[lvysaur]

The homocysteine angle is curious, I'll dig in to it. I'm guessing it's more taxing to the body to keep up with increased energy demands with coffee than caffeine, it may be more metabolism boosting that plain caffeine. Also the blood thickening is probably due to the acclimation period to the diuretic effects. Acute and chronic caffeine/ coffee use seem to be two different worlds.

Personally coffee doesn't feel metabolism-boosting

It feels more like it's quickly depleting stored energy (aka 'excitatory'), which is not the same as producing more energy. But both can lead to more energy flowing through the body, only that in the excitatory path you end up paying for it later, and the energy isn't as controllable

I used to have a similar but much slighter reaction to glutamates, which are known to be excitatory, but I was able to cure this and they no longer bother me at all. I'm not saying coffee is working the same way as glutamates, it actually feels pretty different and the taste is probably a good reason why ('meaty' vs. 'bitter' things are almost never going to act the same) but they're similar in that they both had a "hard to control" state followed by exhaustion (but coffee is just much worse)

with coffee the energy is actually more "useful", but it still feels really wrong, like it's being forced somehow.
with glutamates (in the past, no longer) the excitation was purely limited to muscle twitches and spasms.
With coffee there's sometimes twitches and spasms, but more often it gives me a huge surge of impatient and irritable energy followed by exhaustion

 

[ThinPicking]

Also the blood thickening is probably due to the acclimation period to the diuretic effects.

Or a concomitant and likely pre-existing TBW deficit. The entire circulatory can find new homeostatic setpoints and people can live in them for vast spans of a lifetime if they're not pressing enough buttons to notice. Or worse, if they present to a licensed clinician in an institution for answers.

If a "diabetic" loses sugar and needs to replace it at an unusual rate to stop doing that (assuming the presence and abundance of all other cofactors). Maybe the same is true of water. Maybe the same is true of salt. Maybe the renal system is telling.

"Diabetes mellitus is taken from the Greek word diabetes, meaning siphon - to pass through"

Just musing.

 

[liam183]

Where are you getting this? Bitters have been used as a digestive aid for a very long time and how do you explain the myriad of studies showing coffee to be beneficial to the liver? As you know this is not a common opinion here so curious as to your view.

Had the same thoughts when I read that

 

[ThinPicking]

Had the same thoughts when I read that

Mr Charlie's sentiment is probably correct... when an organism is sitting in a particular well.

I drink 3 strong coffee's a day personally. Coffea's an amazing plant.

 

[Gawdawg]

Ive noticed that coffee of various brands and origins gives me jitters, stuffy nose, strong coffee smelling urine, more peeing etc

But it seems energy drinks with the same dose of caffeine does not.

Some theories i have to why:

The oils in coffee irritate my gut?
Coffee has mold toxins?
Coffee is too acidic?
Coffee has PAHs, which i react to in other contexts where i am exposed to them?
Coffee stimulates the cortisol response stronger than isolated caffeine?

Anyone share the same thing/ have an explanation?

Btw i love coffee and want to consume it but just dont feel right enough to do it regularly.

There was a time when I was drinking four cups of black coffee in the morning. Afterwards I felt very tired, not in a relaxed way. Last year I began adding heavy cream and a tablespoon of sugar to my coffees and that has worked out well for me. Now I have only two cups in the morning. I've heard people using Theanine to prevent coffee jitters.

 

[kaybb]

Because coffee is toxic. Anything that is bitter is toxic to the liver and you.

RP, know for saying it was “vitamin-.like nutrient” ?
Did he say coffee is toxic?

 

[kaybb]

Ive noticed that coffee of various brands and origins gives me jitters, stuffy nose, strong coffee smelling urine, more peeing etc

But it seems energy drinks with the same dose of caffeine does not.

Some theories i have to why:

The oils in coffee irritate my gut?
Coffee has mold toxins?
Coffee is too acidic?
Coffee has PAHs, which i react to in other contexts where i am exposed to them?
Coffee stimulates the cortisol response stronger than isolated caffeine?

Anyone share the same thing/ have an explanation?

Btw i love coffee and want to consume it but just dont feel right enough to do it regularly.

Awhile back @hadiut recommended Inosine for me . I was having bad heart palpitations and jitters from coffee.