Learned Helplessness And Anhedonia

[DaikonRadish]

Hi everyone. I'm a 24 year old guy. I've pretty much failed at everything in my life so far. I'm obese, poor, live with my parents, never had a job, and just don't see the purpose of living. Almost all of my thoughts circle around the idea of life being a brutal competition for status, resources, sex, and basically pleasure, and how I lost this competition. So when I apply for a job, I don't put in much effort because I know there is so much competition for jobs and its basically pointless unless I had lots of status and networking. I also am constantly focused on the idea of male disposability, basically the biological reality of males having to compete for any access to sex, or basically any comfort or pleasure.

I just don't know how to change this. I have been only doing Peat's carrot salad daily and did have some slight relief from the sadness. I also have random crying spells because I'm so lonely and view my self as such a biological failure.

 

[Hans]

Hi everyone. I'm a 24 year old guy. I've pretty much failed at everything in my life so far. I'm obese, poor, live with my parents, never had a job, and just don't see the purpose of living. Almost all of my thoughts circle around the idea of life being a brutal competition for status, resources, sex, and basically pleasure, and how I lost this competition. So when I apply for a job, I don't put in much effort because I know there is so much competition for jobs and its basically pointless unless I had lots of status and networking. I also am constantly focused on the idea of male disposability, basically the biological reality of males having to compete for any access to sex, or basically any comfort or pleasure.

I just don't know how to change this. I have been only doing Peat's carrot salad daily and did have some slight relief from the sadness. I also have random crying spells because I'm so lonely and view my self as such a biological failure.

A lot of your symptoms correlate with excess acetylcholine and low dopamine. Acetylcholine is involved in depression, dysphoria, hyperemotionality, learned helplessness, etc., whereas dopamine is involved with motivation, drive, excitement, exploration, libido, etc. Acetylcholine is usually high when dopamine is low and vise versa. Cyproheptadine is a potent cholinergic antagonist, but it's also a very mild dopamine antagonist, so I'm not sure if it would be the best fit for you. Adamantane has anti-cholinergic and pro-dopamine properties, so maybe that's something you can check out. Idealabs sells it as Diamant.

A few more tips:

• Make sure your diet is optimal, with good amounts of protein and mineral rich food, such as oysters, milk, red meat and organ meat.
• Eat enough carbs with salt.
• Go outside each morning in the sunlight. Sunlight boosts dopamine and lowers stress.
• Walk often, preferably after meals.
• Reduce the time you spend online and on social media.
• Find something you're fascinated by. Even into my early 20s I also had no drive for anything except games and gym. I didn't want to do anything and I was super lazy. I was sure I wasn't going anywhere in life so I thought I'd become a personal training because I only cared about gym. Once I started looking into health I became so fascinated that I became "obsessed" with it and have been researching it non-stop for years now (so glad it didn't become a personal training, what I'm doing now is far better).
• Lastly, change your perspective. No matter how much "competition" there are, there will always be a spot for you. People like you for you, not so much what you have to offer (but that matter too ofc). So if you're a good person with useful skills, there is a place for you and you can become very successful.

 

[Uselis]

All of the above plus this been mentioned here and everywhere else but try to lower your masturbation and especially (if you watch it) pornography exposure.

You're not a failure and at 24 years old there are a lot of room for improvement feeling, looking and performing wise.

 

[golder]

A lot of your symptoms correlate with excess acetylcholine and low dopamine. Acetylcholine is involved in depression, dysphoria, hyperemotionality, learned helplessness, etc., whereas dopamine is involved with motivation, drive, excitement, exploration, libido, etc. Acetylcholine is usually high when dopamine is low and vise versa. Cyproheptadine is a potent cholinergic antagonist, but it's also a very mild dopamine antagonist, so I'm not sure if it would be the best fit for you. Adamantane has anti-cholinergic and pro-dopamine properties, so maybe that's something you can check out. Idealabs sells it as Diamant.

A few more tips:

• Make sure your diet is optimal, with good amounts of protein and mineral rich food, such as oysters, milk, red meat and organ meat.
• Eat enough carbs with salt.
• Go outside each morning in the sunlight. Sunlight boosts dopamine and lowers stress.
• Walk often, preferably after meals.
• Reduce the time you spend online and on social media.
• Find something you're fascinated by. Even into my early 20s I also had no drive for anything except games and gym. I didn't want to do anything and I was super lazy. I was sure I wasn't going anywhere in life so I thought I'd become a personal training because I only cared about gym. Once I started looking into health I became so fascinated that I became "obsessed" with it and have been researching it non-stop for years now (so glad it didn't become a personal training, what I'm doing now is far better).
• Lastly, change your perspective. No matter how much "competition" there are, there will always be a spot for you. People like you for you, not so much what you have to offer (but that matter too ofc). So if you're a good person with useful skills, there is a place for you and you can become very successful.

Solid advice Hans, thank you. Out of curioity, what sort of topical/oral(?) Diamant dosage would you advocate for this instance of learned helplessness? Obviously with the caveat that self experimentation is the overarching solution. Just looking for a benchmark in your educated opinion.

 

[Frankdee20]

Are eggs not okay to eat if you suspect acetylcholine high symptoms ? Choline is obviously good for the liver, but how does it get acetylated from diet and enter the brain ?

 

[stumpus]

Have you ever tried Wellbutrin? It's somewhat unique (for me, anyway) in that it is an NDRI is the only medicine that actually affected my anhedonia. I tried quite a few different antidepressants (SSRI's and SNRI's) and finally gave up and dealt with it for a long time before stumbling across its effects while trialing a medication called Contrave, which helps you lose weight by just completely removing the reward you get from food. If you can handle it naturally, by all means, but I dealt with depression and anhedonia for 30+ years. Nothing ever affected or touched it, and I tried countless protocols, medicines, and supplements.

You could also just try Contrave if you are overweight to try and mitigate two issues at once, but side effects can be brutal. I have had zero side effects from the Wellbutrin, so I'm guessing it was the Naltrexone part of Contrave. However, I will say that it worked very well at destroying appetite. I would be eating and then suddenly just not want anymore. Eating more repulsed me. Ultimately, I had to stop the Contrave due to stomach pain but during my time on it, I noticed small things, like television that has always just been on for background noise, I was actually enjoying the shows. So, I sought out to trial Wellbutrin on its own. My anhedonia started when I was in my late teens. I just remember one weekend pleasure just turning off like a switch, and from that point on, only food and sex were intense enough to enjoy. Everything else was just flat.. not worth doing.

Anyway, if you can just get a foothold into feeling better and gain momentum, it can help propel you into defeating all of these other demons.

 

[Collden]

Hi everyone. I'm a 24 year old guy. I've pretty much failed at everything in my life so far. I'm obese, poor, live with my parents, never had a job, and just don't see the purpose of living. Almost all of my thoughts circle around the idea of life being a brutal competition for status, resources, sex, and basically pleasure, and how I lost this competition. So when I apply for a job, I don't put in much effort because I know there is so much competition for jobs and its basically pointless unless I had lots of status and networking. I also am constantly focused on the idea of male disposability, basically the biological reality of males having to compete for any access to sex, or basically any comfort or pleasure.

I just don't know how to change this. I have been only doing Peat's carrot salad daily and did have some slight relief from the sadness. I also have random crying spells because I'm so lonely and view my self as such a biological failure.

You need a change of perspective most of all. A lot of men think that superficial traits like height, physique or money matter more than they actually do, and that if they lost the genetic lottery they are essentially doomed. Fact is your inner qualities are much more important for sucess, with women and other things, and you can always work to improve your inner qualities. Once you realize this, life becomes not a competition with others but a competition with yourself, a game to always strive to become a better person tomorrow than you are today.

There are plenty of guys out there who are pulling good women and enjoying life in spite of being short, fat, ugly or poor, its now your job to figure out how to become one of them.

 

[Hans]

Solid advice Hans, thank you. Out of curioity, what sort of topical/oral(?) Diamant dosage would you advocate for this instance of learned helplessness? Obviously with the caveat that self experimentation is the overarching solution. Just looking for a benchmark in your educated opinion.

I'd probably start with the full dose and see how I'd react. It can be potent for some and do nothing for others. So you'll have to tinker with the dose. Alternatively, forskolin can actually also help lower excess acetylcholine.

 

[Frankdee20]

Have you ever tried Wellbutrin? It's somewhat unique (for me, anyway) in that it is an NDRI is the only medicine that actually affected my anhedonia. I tried quite a few different antidepressants (SSRI's and SNRI's) and finally gave up and dealt with it for a long time before stumbling across its effects while trialing a medication called Contrave, which helps you lose weight by just completely removing the reward you get from food. If you can handle it naturally, by all means, but I dealt with depression and anhedonia for 30+ years. Nothing ever affected or touched it, and I tried countless protocols, medicines, and supplements.

You could also just try Contrave if you are overweight to try and mitigate two issues at once, but side effects can be brutal. I have had zero side effects from the Wellbutrin, so I'm guessing it was the Naltrexone part of Contrave. However, I will say that it worked very well at destroying appetite. I would be eating and then suddenly just not want anymore. Eating more repulsed me. Ultimately, I had to stop the Contrave due to stomach pain but during my time on it, I noticed small things, like television that has always just been on for background noise, I was actually enjoying the shows. So, I sought out to trial Wellbutrin on its own. My anhedonia started when I was in my late teens. I just remember one weekend pleasure just turning off like a switch, and from that point on, only food and sex were intense enough to enjoy. Everything else was just flat.. not worth doing.

Anyway, if you can just get a foothold into feeling better and gain momentum, it can help propel you into defeating all of these other demons.

Bupropion is also a derivative of Cathinone, the methaphetamine like shrub often abused in the Middle East..... its a nicotine receptor antagonist, and it’s a decent drug but has a propensity to increase seizures at doses above 300 mg a day, and that’s why the XR and SR versions gained popularity with psychiatric patients

 

[Peatness]

I read this article often and each time I find it helpful

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From the article

Supplements of thyroid and progesterone are proven to be generally protective against the cholinergic threats, but there are many other factors that can be adjusted according to particular needs. Niacinamide, like progesterone, inhibits the production of nitric oxide, and also like progesterone, it improves recovery from brain injury (Hoane, et al., 2008). In genetically altered mice with an Alzheimer's trait, niacinamide corrects the defect (Green, et al., 2008). Drugs such as atropine and antihistamines can be used in crisis situations. Bright light, without excess ultraviolet, should be available every day.

The cholinergic system is much more than a part of the nervous system, and is involved in cell metabolism and tissue renewal. Most people can benefit from reducing intake of phosphate, iron, and polyunsaturated fats (which can inhibit cholinesterase; Willis, et al., 2009), and from choosing foods that reduce production and absorption of endotoxin. And, obviously, drugs that are intended to increase the effects of nitric oxide (asparagine, zildenafil/Viagra, minoxidil/Rogaine) and acetylcholine (bethanechol, benzpyrinium, etc.) should be avoided.