Niacinamide Is Androgenic And Increases Dht Effects/signaling

[David Chung]

1/2 life of niacinamide at 1 g is about an hour. With 500 mg, it is probably even shorter.

Given its short half life, I don't think you'd get that much SIRT1 deactivation. The cortisol lowering effect should be brief as well.

 

[haidut]

In your Glycine strongly upregulates 5-AR thread you said "This mean that oral glycine doses in the range of 500mg - 16g are needed to achieve the effective concentration in the brain. The effect is dose-dependent, so the higher the glycine dose the more effective it is on allopregnanolone and 5-AR activity. " So 16 grams of Glycine per day has the exact same effect on 5-AR as 500mg?!? Thanks!

The glycine concentration in the brain was found to be about 100 times lower than plasma. So, if you want to achieve the concentrations in the brain, so that brain levels of allopregnanolone and DHT rise, then doses of 500mg - 16g glycine are needed, the higher the better. But for regular tissues around the body, the dose is much lower - as little as 100mg should do.

 

[David Chung]

Just wanted to add, to my prior post - I tried both a time-release version and a regular version of niacinamide. I say stick with the regular version.

 

[sladerunner69]

I'll come out with a new product: Fapsteride.

It's a combination of finasteride and amphetamine so you can go to town for 8 hours.

Eeeeegaaaaahhhdddd!!

Finasteride certainly does not raise dht or help give a man arousal or erections... absolutely the opposite. I k ow because I took that little red pill for a few weeks when I was just 18 and it critically destroyed me physically and mentally

things have literally never been the same for me! I still have less than fufilling sexual arousal/experience, become fatigued easily and have difficulty concentrating. Such a traumatizing experience with legal medication has also left an impacy on my personality as some seriously deep wounds. People often ask if I had been in thw military because I can be very serious and blunt at times, which is in fact very differwnt from happy-go-lucky me before my propecia crash. I am slowly working my way back and will triumph in the end and find myself as a stronger, more resiliwnt and well rounded individual... but finasteride has been a living hell please please do not take it!!!

 

[DaveFoster]

Eeeeegaaaaahhhdddd!!

Finasteride certainly does not raise dht or help give a man arousal or erections... absolutely the opposite. I k ow because I took that little red pill for a few weeks when I was just 18 and it critically destroyed me physically and mentally

things have literally never been the same for me! I still have less than fufilling sexual arousal/experience, become fatigued easily and have difficulty concentrating. Such a traumatizing experience with legal medication has also left an impacy on my personality as some seriously deep wounds. People often ask if I had been in thw military because I can be very serious and blunt at times, which is in fact very differwnt from happy-go-lucky me before my propecia crash. I am slowly working my way back and will triumph in the end and find myself as a stronger, more resiliwnt and well rounded individual... but finasteride has been a living hell please please do not take it!!!

Jesus, that's horrible. Way to be positive.

What has been the most helpful for you to restore your libido by the way? You said nicotine and DHEA; anything else?

 

[milk_lover]

Eeeeegaaaaahhhdddd!!

Finasteride certainly does not raise dht or help give a man arousal or erections... absolutely the opposite. I k ow because I took that little red pill for a few weeks when I was just 18 and it critically destroyed me physically and mentally

things have literally never been the same for me! I still have less than fufilling sexual arousal/experience, become fatigued easily and have difficulty concentrating. Such a traumatizing experience with legal medication has also left an impacy on my personality as some seriously deep wounds. People often ask if I had been in thw military because I can be very serious and blunt at times, which is in fact very differwnt from happy-go-lucky me before my propecia crash. I am slowly working my way back and will triumph in the end and find myself as a stronger, more resiliwnt and well rounded individual... but finasteride has been a living hell please please do not take it!!!

good luck, sladerunner69 I am pretty sure you can beat finasteride consequences. Having it still approved by FDA is beyond me..

 

[sladerunner69]

Yes I will conquer and slay this beast no doubt! What is the recommended peat dosage of niacinimide daily? Is it advisable to use before bedtime?

 

[ecstatichamster]

50 to 100mg one to three times a day. It lowers blood sugar. It can give you a headache if you don't have enough glycogen, like caffeine does. I don't take it before bedtime. I take it after I eat.

 

[Drareg]

If you are low on DHEA and take glycine and niacinamide would this be an issue?

I'm not talking bottomed out completely but just slightly low for reasons of aging or excessive stress?

 

[bdawg]

Can someone explain this?

"In summary, we successfully identified a novel chemical entity, the nicotinamide compound DIMN, as a non-steroidal AR antagonist through receptor-based virtual screening. The potent AR antagonism of this compound has been confirmed by AR-ligand binding competition, the blocking of AR activation steps, the reduced expression of AR target genes, and the considerably inhibited proliferation of AR-expressing prostate cancer cells, either androgen-dependent or androgenindependent. The remarkable potency of the action of the compound DIMN on both prostate cancer cell types as well as their strong antiandrogenic activity suggests that this compound could be potent drug candidate for the treatment of early stage to advanced prostate cancers, potentially replacing currently established anticancer medicines such as BIC"

http://www.jbc.org/content/early/2012/07/13/jbc.M112.379107.full.pdf

 

[haidut]

Can someone explain this?

"In summary, we successfully identified a novel chemical entity, the nicotinamide compound DIMN, as a non-steroidal AR antagonist through receptor-based virtual screening. The potent AR antagonism of this compound has been confirmed by AR-ligand binding competition, the blocking of AR activation steps, the reduced expression of AR target genes, and the considerably inhibited proliferation of AR-expressing prostate cancer cells, either androgen-dependent or androgenindependent. The remarkable potency of the action of the compound DIMN on both prostate cancer cell types as well as their strong antiandrogenic activity suggests that this compound could be potent drug candidate for the treatment of early stage to advanced prostate cancers, potentially replacing currently established anticancer medicines such as BIC"

http://www.jbc.org/content/early/2012/07/13/jbc.M112.379107.full.pdf

Other than using nicotinamide as a scaffold, this chemical does not have much in common with nicotinamide and its properties. If you read the full study you will see that another nicotinamide derivative did not behave as antagonist. So, it is the extra molecules they attached to nicotinamide that make it an antagonist of the AR.

 

[Frankdee20]

I think it's best to take in the evening so that it gets a chance to metabolize properly before cortisol starts to rise. Once cortisol is high, DHEA may actually get turned to estrone since cortisol activates aromatase. So, yes, pregnenolone + DHEA is a good idea but probably best taken before stress hormones rise. Once cortisol is high, I'd stick to pure pregnenolone, progesterone, glycine, niacinamide, theanine, etc.

Why is Pregnenalone stimulating if it supposedly has anti stress effects ?

 

[haidut]

Why is Pregnenalone stimulating if it supposedly has anti stress effects ?

If you take a higher dose it converts mostly into pregnenolone sulfate (PS) which is a GABA antagonist and can interfere with sleep and/or relaxation.

 

[Frankdee20]

I know the reference to a bell curve GABA agonism for Pregnenalone was mentioned. So then what's the typical low end oral dosage required to get calming effects ? 10-20 was way too crazy for me. Or does this all depend upon resting metabolic factors, cortisol function and thyroid function ? Since Pregnenalone interacts with these systems.

 

[haidut]

I know the reference to a bell curve GABA agonism for Pregnenalone was mentioned. So then what's the typical low end oral dosage required to get calming effects ? 10-20 was way too crazy for me. Or does this all depend upon resting metabolic factors, cortisol function and thyroid function ? Since Pregnenalone interacts with these systems.

Usually 10mg or below should be sedating. In one human study 1mg improved sleep a LOT and it would not have done so if it was stimulating. But it really depends on the hormonal state of each person.

 

[Frankdee20]

Thanks, after I get my new blood results, I'll experiment with taking 5MG. See how it goes. I know the TSH result will be useless unless it's high.

 

[Lokzo]

I'll come out with a new product: Fapsteride.

It's a combination of finasteride and amphetamine so you can go to town for 8 hours.

HAhahaha!

 

[Hgreen56]

I think it's best to take in the evening so that it gets a chance to metabolize properly before cortisol starts to rise. .

so your advice is to take niacinamide also in the evening?

 

[Highserotonin90]

How is it possible that niacinamide inhibits SIRTI which is necessary to make NAD?

 

[charlie]

How is it possible that niacinamide inhibits SIRTI which is necessary to make NAD?

That is an excellent question. It looks like Niacinamide literally turns off life, while Niacin as Nicotinic Acid literally pumps life into the body:

"the Preiss–Handler pathway was highly active in mammalian cells,
and this approach increased the level of NAD+ to a greater extent than NR [nicotinamide riboside] or NMN [nicotinamide mononucleotide],
which indicated the high efficiency of NA for NAD+ synthesis"

"NAD+ synthesis using NA is more efficient than that using NAM [nicotinamide]
well known that NAM is produced when NAD+-dependent enzymes consume NAD+
additional [NAM] supplementation does not enhance NAD+ synthesis"

"articles have reported that the efficiency of NAD+ synthesis with NA is higher than that with NAM"

"NAM is believed to be present in sufficient amounts in the body because NAD+ is decomposed to produce NAM, which re-enters the NAD+ synthesis pathway
NAM is an inhibitor of the SIRTs family
Excessive concentrations of NAM inhibit the activity of SIRT2
and shorten the lifespan"

"the nicotinamidase PncA, which appears to have been abandoned during the evolution of the NAD+ synthesis pathway, has the potential for NAD+ synthesis in mammals"

"efficiency of using NA for NAD+ synthesis appears to be highest in the liver. In addition, PncA can process excessive NAM in the liver, thereby relieving the inhibition of SIRT1 by NAM and increasing the activity of SIRT1
PncA also substantially increases NAD+ levels in other organs that rely on NA for NAD+"

Bacterial PncA improves diet-induced NAFLD in mice by enabling the transition from nicotinamide to nicotinic acid

Source: Bacterial PncA improves diet-induced NAFLD in mice by enabling the transition from nicotinamide to nicotinic acid - Communications Biology