Why Does Starch Make Me Extremely Sick?

[milk_lover]

Whenever I eat starch my face becomes tanned and dark hinting there may be an increase of serotonin/endotoxins, stress reaction from blood sugar fluctuations (blood sugar crash), or/and increase in estrogen or prolactin. I am not imagining stuff. I see it in the mirror and I feel it. Simple sugars NO issue at all! I am trying my best to ditch starch as much as I can but it's very difficult to quit.

 

[EIRE24]

Whenever I eat starch my face becomes tanned and dark hinting there may be an increase of serotonin/endotoxins, stress reaction from blood sugar fluctuations (blood sugar crash), or/and increase in estrogen or prolactin. I am not imagining stuff. I see it in the mirror and I feel it. Simple sugars NO issue at all! I am trying my best to ditch starch as much as I can but it's very difficult to quit.

If it is from blood sugar crash then it isn't really the starch but could be that you aren't balancing macros and ratios to keep blood sugar in check?

 

[milk_lover]

If it is from blood sugar crash then it isn't really the starch but could be that you aren't balancing macros and ratios to keep blood sugar in check?

I always eat starch with protein and some fat. I don't think the ratio is that off. Maybe it's not a blood sugar issue I was just speculating.

 

[EIRE24]

I always eat starch with protein and some fat. I don't think the ratio is that off. Maybe it's not a blood sugar issue I was just speculating.

Ah, I understand.

 

[tara]

Hi Artist,
Just wondering, have you experimented with activated charcoal at all? Eg a good dose a couple of times a week?
I wonder if it would help lower the bacterial population enough to reduce some of the trouble you associate with starch?
The down-sides of AC that I'm aware of are that:
- it adsorbs any nutrients around as well as the stuff you want rid of (mitigate by taking away from food and supps)
- there may be potential for persorption of small particles in the gut (maybe mitigate by using more granular form)
- contributes to constipation for some (mitigate with carrot salad or cascara sagrada or coffee or whatever works for you)

 

[artist]

Hi Artist,
Just wondering, have you experimented with activated charcoal at all? Eg a good dose a couple of times a week?
I wonder if it would help lower the bacterial population enough to reduce some of the trouble you associate with starch?
The down-sides of AC that I'm aware of are that:
- it adsorbs any nutrients around as well as the stuff you want rid of (mitigate by taking away from food and supps)
- there may be potential for persorption of small particles in the gut (maybe mitigate by using more granular form)
- contributes to constipation for some (mitigate with carrot salad or cascara sagrada or coffee or whatever works for you)

I did try it once but as you pointed out as a risk, it totally stopped my digestion, like I was ridiculously backed up lol. Of course that's the last thing you want when trying to kill gut bacteria. This was last summer and I haven't tried it since. I may give it a shot again after my course with the herbal antimicrobials

I find the same thing with starch. It definitely increases my acne, it never did before I started incorporating peats ideas and reccomended food though which is strange. So, is your acne under control if you avoid starch?

It's more under control but not completely, depends on a lot of factors unfortunately. But it becomes ridiculous if I start eating pasta or anything like that, specifically my skin becomes very very greasy. Coffee does this as well (but not pure caffeine)

 

[artist]

This week I'm going to experiment with cutting fat out completely and consuming starch only in the form of slow cooker soups with potatoes and various other vegetables and see what happens. I will still be on the oregano oil and cinnamon routine. I will report back

 

[artist]

Zero-fat high-starch after almost 1 week: So far this is a huge improvement. I haven't had any fat for the past 6 days other than the trace amounts that exist in yukon potatoes, vegetable soup, corn pasta, bananas, orange juice etc. This is exactly what I was eating in previous failed attempts to include starch only I was also having butter and cheese with it before. Without fat my skin actually seems to be calmer than normal and I wake up feeling very calm and light whereas usually I feel like I did not sleep at all and quite stressed out before even opening my eyes (even with no starch). Lost some uncomfortable swelling in my thighs and stomach (pretty sure it's water) and feel like my circulation is better. My digestion is the best it has ever been that I can remember, quite different and very fast compared to before this experiment. It's a bit early to say it's "working" but it's so novel and exciting to me that I had to share!

I'm definitely gonna keep up the zero fat thing for at least a full month now. I am pretty lactose intolerant so if I include dairy it'll be some FF greek yogurt or lactose-free milk, but as of now I have no craving for anything like that, or even any fat for that matter. To be honest I think I could use the break from calcium for just high magnesium foods. I am having a bit of a hard time keeping calories high enough as I usually don't eat such voluminous foods and I do have a history of restrictive eating and it's easy to naturally slip down to just eating 1500 cals a day. I'm still sussing out if I can tolerate wheat at this time.

I am still taking the oregano oil but I have not been that consistent with it and I started to totally forget about the cinnamon. I don't think they're the reason this is working out because it isn't my first time using them and it never had that huge of an impact before. I was simply hoping staying on them longer and more consistently would do the job but I might just drop them now

I didn't realize until a day or two into this trial that there is quite a bit of anecdotal evidence of people sorting out "candida"/gut issues with zero/very low fat diets. Familiarity with Peat has primed me to buy how this could be possible and it does seem to be potentially doing that for me

 

[DaveFoster]

Zero-fat high-starch after almost 1 week: So far this is a huge improvement. I haven't had any fat for the past 6 days other than the trace amounts that exist in yukon potatoes, vegetable soup, corn pasta, bananas, orange juice etc. This is exactly what I was eating in previous failed attempts to include starch only I was also having butter and cheese with it before. Without fat my skin actually seems to be calmer than normal and I wake up feeling very calm and light whereas usually I feel like I did not sleep at all and quite stressed out before even opening my eyes (even with no starch). Lost some uncomfortable swelling in my thighs and stomach (pretty sure it's water) and feel like my circulation is better. My digestion is the best it has ever been that I can remember, quite different and very fast compared to before this experiment. It's a bit early to say it's "working" but it's so novel and exciting to me that I had to share!

I'm definitely gonna keep up the zero fat thing for at least a full month now. I am pretty lactose intolerant so if I include dairy it'll be some FF greek yogurt or lactose-free milk, but as of now I have no craving for anything like that, or even any fat for that matter. To be honest I think I could use the break from calcium for just high magnesium foods. I am having a bit of a hard time keeping calories high enough as I usually don't eat such voluminous foods and I do have a history of restrictive eating and it's easy to naturally slip down to just eating 1500 cals a day. I'm still sussing out if I can tolerate wheat at this time.

I am still taking the oregano oil but I have not been that consistent with it and I started to totally forget about the cinnamon. I don't think they're the reason this is working out because it isn't my first time using them and it never had that huge of an impact before. I was simply hoping staying on them longer and more consistently would do the job but I might just drop them now

I didn't realize until a day or two into this trial that there is quite a bit of anecdotal evidence of people sorting out "candida"/gut issues with zero/very low fat diets. Familiarity with Peat has primed me to buy how this could be possible and it does seem to be potentially doing that for me

Keep us updated. Very interesting, way to go. Reminds me of WestsidePUFA

 

[lvysaur]

I never get issues from white rice or bread (even whole wheat bread), but potatoes give me noticeable symptoms.

The bread might simply be because I never eat enough bread (it's mostly air)

 

[artist]

Keep us updated. Very interesting, way to go. Reminds me of WestsidePUFA

I did search around for other people here who have had good results with starch and his posts definitely influenced me to evaluate the fat component more carefully. I think Zachs is another one who endorses high starch although looking around it seems most people here are eating a good amount, they just eat it in combination with more fat

I realized that a McDougall style "whole foods" approach isn't going to work for me right now because my appetite is just not strong enough for 2500 calories worth of rice or potatoes, I have to eat flour products to hit that mark. I did buy some Ezekiel bread which is technically flour free, and if I could live off of this stuff I would but it's pricy. It's hard to find normal bread made without enriched flour and I take Peat's recommendation against it to heart.

I believe a significant part of why I feel better on this high starch style has to do with its density, ie high cal, low water carbs that lend themselves well to heavy salting. I know people around here discuss this quite a bit but it is nigh impossible to achieve this without starch while still keeping the fat low, and God knows I tried. There's only so much jam a person can eat. Drinking a lot of water or lemonade (which is more watery than OJ, my preferred libation) makes me feel worse quickly. I notice I get that warm-all-over energized circulatory feeling from eating much more readily now, and this was a pretty rare occurrence previously.

 

[Ewelina]

@artist
Congratulations on your improvement! I'm very interested in your posts as I am trying to cut fat as low as possible myself and I understand how difficult it is without including starch in the diet. This is new for me as well as I've avoided starches for almost 10 years.

 

[ecstatichamster]

Ezekiel bread has pufas in the form of seeds. Sprouting helps but how much?

 

[tara]

It's a bit early to say it's "working" but it's so novel and exciting to me that I had to share!

Nice story.

It's hard to find normal bread made without enriched flour and I take Peat's recommendation against it to heart.

I've been using variants on this recipe SuQ posted a while ago:
easy no knead bread recipe
Very little work-time involved in making it, just long leavening time. After reading some of ecstatichamster's comments on bread baking, I've extended the leavening time to 24-48 hrs.

 

[DaveFoster]

I did search around for other people here who have had good results with starch and his posts definitely influenced me to evaluate the fat component more carefully. I think Zachs is another one who endorses high starch although looking around it seems most people here are eating a good amount, they just eat it in combination with more fat

I realized that a McDougall style "whole foods" approach isn't going to work for me right now because my appetite is just not strong enough for 2500 calories worth of rice or potatoes, I have to eat flour products to hit that mark. I did buy some Ezekiel bread which is technically flour free, and if I could live off of this stuff I would but it's pricy. It's hard to find normal bread made without enriched flour and I take Peat's recommendation against it to heart.

I believe a significant part of why I feel better on this high starch style has to do with its density, ie high cal, low water carbs that lend themselves well to heavy salting. I know people around here discuss this quite a bit but it is nigh impossible to achieve this without starch while still keeping the fat low, and God knows I tried. There's only so much jam a person can eat. Drinking a lot of water or lemonade (which is more watery than OJ, my preferred libation) makes me feel worse quickly. I notice I get that warm-all-over energized circulatory feeling from eating much more readily now, and this was a pretty rare occurrence previously.

OJ concentrate is what I do if you can handle it. Half OJ concentrate, half water. It's very sweet, but not too sweet. Dilute as necessary. If your liver isn't working optimally, this is probably a bad idea.

 

[tara]

Sprouting helps but how much?

I think sprouting makes the protein more digestible, but as far as I know it doesn't reduce PUFA at all?

 

[whodathunkit]

Very Low Fat (VLF)/high carb/high starch is a fantastic intervention. And by VLF I mean no added fat at all for a week or however long you can tolerate it. A week is about as long as I've been able to stick with it myself.

IMO it's not a way of life, though. "Intervention" is the best word for it.

I've had really good luck with "pulsing" VLF with a lower-fat Peat-style eating. It's helped me shake a couple of weight plateaus, and IMO VLF is unparalleled for helping clean up the liver. I credit a large measure of my very recent first-time-ever success with progesterone to VLF/high carb. I think my liver is now able to metabolize the estrogen that progesterone may be flushing out of my fat cells, whereas before VLF, it couldn't do it. I got terrible bloating and other estrogen symptoms from progesterone. Not this time, and I've worked up to a hammerknocker dose fairly quickly, for a specific short-term purpose. Last time I tried this dose (several years ago) I wanted to kill myself within two days. Now it's been almost a week and I feel great. Go liver!

By starch I mean potatoes (sweet and regular), and rice, things like that. Not grains except maybe oats...but not too much of them. I loves me my porridge, even though I don't eat it often these days. With honey and chopped dates and a banana it's like eating nectar of the Gods. :) You don't need any fat in that. If I eat it too much I feel the PUFA, though, so porridge intake is very limited.

I stay away from bread and grains except for special occasions, and even then is very limited.

Starch (particularly resistant starch) has been a lynchpin of my recovery, starting a couple of years ago. IME Peat is right about it can feed bad bacteria, but he neglects that it also feeds the good guys, and we really need them. The simpler sugars and less dense fibers in fruits are typically digested before they get to the long stretch of the large intestine, which is where a lot of our best bacterias live and where starch (particularly resistant starch) can go. I believe a crappy gut is a big reason why my first attempt with Peat years ago was unsuccessful. A diet lacking in starch just compounds a crappy gut, even when eating correctives like the carrot salad. Gut health seems not to be only a point of soaking up the byproduct of the bad guys; we also have to alter the balance of flora from good to bad, too. Sometimes we need to achieve this beneficial balance sooner rather than later, otherwise we can get derailed from our good intentions if marginal or poor results go on too long. This is where good probiotics can help.

IME when you have a preponderance of bad bacteria in relation to the good, starch can feed the bad guys more in the beginning. That's no fun. Probiotics helped me a lot with achieving a better balance of good bacteria that supported my health. There is definitely something to the idea that probiotics don't necessarily give us the bacteria we exactly need, so there is a point where more is not better. And some people react poorly to certain strains. But if you've got a lot of bad guys eating up your fiber and making endotoxin, good probiotics can help you achieve a more healthful balance. Probiotics helped me A LOT, especially with endurance and exercise tolerance, so they seemed to do something (have no idea what or how) to boost mitochondrial function. At least in some of us, they have that effect.

Personally, I stayed away from the lactobacilli and concentrated on the bifidos and some of the more exotic soil based bacterias. I also like clostritdium butyricum a lot. That strain is a big player in your body being able to manufacture its own butyrate from the foods you eat. Plus, when my dogs eat something nasty when off leash and get diarrhea, c.butyricum clears it up within a day. Works better and is better for them than Immodium.

A guy named Tim Steele has a good book out about biohacking with potatoes. It's a good read, and the potato hack is a very valuable, no PUFA intervention. I can't do it for more than about five days in a row, but I've done it 4-5 times, and it's a great adjunct to good health.

The Potato Hack: Weight Loss Simplified: Mr. Tim Steele: 9781530028627: Amazon.com: Books

Warning: if your gut is in bad shape and you start using starch, particularly raw powdered potato starch or cooked/cooled potatoes, you may get gas and bloating. This is not necessarily a bad thing (it means your gut bugs are chowing down, and they're not all bad), and unless it's too uncomfortable and inconvenient, will often pass on its own as your bacteria get used to being fed again.

But please don't take my word for any of this this. There's a lot of info out there. It's searchable, and searching is how I got onto it in the first place. Googling the term "resistant starch" is a good place to start. I'm just passing on what worked for me.

As with everything, balance is the key.

 

[Jayfish]

I always eat starch with protein and some fat. I don't think the ratio is that off. Maybe it's not a blood sugar issue I was just speculating.

Imo, starch and protein is a horrible combo for blood sugar and Endotoxin. Added fat will only slow digestion adding more time for Endotoxin buildup and longer raised insulin levels. Ditch the starch, eat more sat fat and protein with your sugar if you need more calories.

 

[artist]

@artist
Congratulations on your improvement! I'm very interested in your posts as I am trying to cut fat as low as possible myself and I understand how difficult it is without including starch in the diet. This is new for me as well as I've avoided starches for almost 10 years.

Thanks! I was hoping this can be useful to others

Ezekiel bread has pufas in the form of seeds. Sprouting helps but how much?

Not all Ezekiel breads have non-grain seeds in them, the one I bought doesn't and the label says 0g of fat per slice

I've been using variants on this recipe SuQ posted a while ago:
easy no knead bread recipe
Very little work-time involved in making it, just long leavening time. After reading some of ecstatichamster's comments on bread baking, I've extended the leavening time to 24-48 hrs.

Thanks I will give it a shot

OJ concentrate is what I do if you can handle it. Half OJ concentrate, half water. It's very sweet, but not too sweet. Dilute as necessary. If your liver isn't working optimally, this is probably a bad idea.

I have never tried OJ concentrate, sounds like it could be a good option

 

[artist]

@whodathunkit no added fat is what I'm doing, but I'm planning to keep it up for at least 3 more weeks if not longer.. I do think I have excess bacteria in my small intestine but interestingly it seems like not adding fat either speeds digestion or helps with blood sugar issues in such a way that they aren't able to feed on the starch so much. I'm still a little wary of probiotics but I might add saurkraut and/or (fat free) kefir in a week or two and see what happens