A Case For Intermittent Fasting

[Westside PUFAs]

post 113262 I really need to drop some fat and despite Peat-eating make me more stress-free im stucked with a belly fat

I think it will be hard to lose belly fat if you still consume whole milk and too much butter or creamed coffee, even with fasting.

 

[DankMemes]

I wonder how well rats digest fat? Fasting means larger meals(if calories are controlled) so maybe they're just not absorbing as much?

Just an idea...

 

[DrJ]

post 113294

post 113273 Unfortunately, the study seems to not have lasted very long: ~20 weeks. Not quite half a year. I came to Peating from doing IF, and my experience was that I felt great for about the first 6 months on IF. But after, that I did not. I attribute this to how long it took for me to acclimate to the stress hormones, cortisol and adrenaline. Can I prove this? Of course I cannot since I did not do blood tests.

What I do know is that after IF, my body temp was in the mid-to-low 95.xF, and I was cold all of the time. After Peating for over 18mo, I sit above at least 97.5F and usually above 98F, and feel much better; and this is without aspirin any more. I think it's safe to say after 18mo stress hormones are not the reason.

That said, I lost much weight on IF. I was lean and veiny. Now, I am lean and not veiny, but it took some time to figure out how to achieve this, and it was mainly by not eating too much fat (read: ice cream :)). But I prefer the Peat way because I am not cold, my energy levels are very constant from waking to sleeping, I sleep much better and wake naturally, and my mental clarity is substantially better. I would just warn anyone contemplating IF to consider that you might do significant damage to your metabolism, and in my case, it took about a year to fully correct.

What did you do to recover and what kind of foods do you eat now? I am in a similar situation so it would be very helpful to me?

Well, most importantly after switching from IF to Peat-ing I cut out PUFA relentlessly since, after reading Peat's articles, it seemed very clear to me that they were universally awful, and since they take a while to work out of your system, it's better to start de-PUFA-ing sooner rather than later.

And I carried a thermometer everywhere and was constantly checking my temp because I thought it was really amazing that I could get instant feedback like that. I want to qualify instant here in that you really are aiming for long term overall temp increase during all times of the day, but it's nice to have a metric you can constantly check on. And I didn't realize immediately because they seem like small numbers, but something like a 0.2F change is important to note, and 0.5F is quite significant (assuming accurate thermometer). Also take note of your heart rate and if your extremities feel cold. If your extremities are cold, but your temp is high, it's stress hormones. If your heart rate is low, but temp high, it's stress hormones. Also, this is how I realized aspirin was working, because I could see my temp change within a half hour of taking it.

I didn't immediately cut out vegetables and beans b/c I didn't really believe that at first, but now I agree, and cut those out, aiming for less than 5g fiber a day (unless from carrot) which helped my digestion and feelings (and looks sometimes) of bloat.

But importantly you want to get high protein, at least 100g/day. You want to get it from dairy protein (casein), and gelatin or broth as much as possible. So, I eat tons of cheese and milk. Some eggs, less than 6 per week. I eat fruit snacks made from fruit juice and gelatin for sugar and a small bit of protein, and also orange juice for sugar. I'm really just following what Peat says. Personally, I find I can get away with some no-fiber wheat products like really white bread and water crackers, but not everyone will. Peat recommends potatoes if you cook them a lot, but I'm not sure I tolerate it, so test it for yourself. I can eat small amounts of white rice, like less than a half cup (after cooking!). I have mixed results with coconut oil, but I think it has to do with refined vs unrefined and am still trying to figure that out. OH! And Caffeine! Lots of coffee as long as your consuming adequate sugar! I am up to 800mg/day caffeine.

The mistake I made early was hitting ice cream too hard and I gained weight. It has lots of fat, and little protein, but will make you feel full, so will likely make you get too little protein, and protein supports your thyroid function. Basically, reducing fat and increasing protein and calcium and salt leans me out, and probably generally works for anyone. And once you get your temp up, don't be afraid of sugar. I think IF tends to make you scared of it, especially if your doing it with a paleo flavor as is common, but when you get your metabolism running right, you can just think of sugar as raw fuel that keeps you burning like a heat lamp rather than going to fat as is usually assumed.

 

[livrepensador]

post 113521

post 113294

post 113273 Unfortunately, the study seems to not have lasted very long: ~20 weeks. Not quite half a year. I came to Peating from doing IF, and my experience was that I felt great for about the first 6 months on IF. But after, that I did not. I attribute this to how long it took for me to acclimate to the stress hormones, cortisol and adrenaline. Can I prove this? Of course I cannot since I did not do blood tests.

What I do know is that after IF, my body temp was in the mid-to-low 95.xF, and I was cold all of the time. After Peating for over 18mo, I sit above at least 97.5F and usually above 98F, and feel much better; and this is without aspirin any more. I think it's safe to say after 18mo stress hormones are not the reason.

That said, I lost much weight on IF. I was lean and veiny. Now, I am lean and not veiny, but it took some time to figure out how to achieve this, and it was mainly by not eating too much fat (read: ice cream :)). But I prefer the Peat way because I am not cold, my energy levels are very constant from waking to sleeping, I sleep much better and wake naturally, and my mental clarity is substantially better. I would just warn anyone contemplating IF to consider that you might do significant damage to your metabolism, and in my case, it took about a year to fully correct.

What did you do to recover and what kind of foods do you eat now? I am in a similar situation so it would be very helpful to me?

Well, most importantly after switching from IF to Peat-ing I cut out PUFA relentlessly since, after reading Peat's articles, it seemed very clear to me that they were universally awful, and since they take a while to work out of your system, it's better to start de-PUFA-ing sooner rather than later.

And I carried a thermometer everywhere and was constantly checking my temp because I thought it was really amazing that I could get instant feedback like that. I want to qualify instant here in that you really are aiming for long term overall temp increase during all times of the day, but it's nice to have a metric you can constantly check on. And I didn't realize immediately because they seem like small numbers, but something like a 0.2F change is important to note, and 0.5F is quite significant (assuming accurate thermometer). Also take note of your heart rate and if your extremities feel cold. If your extremities are cold, but your temp is high, it's stress hormones. If your heart rate is low, but temp high, it's stress hormones. Also, this is how I realized aspirin was working, because I could see my temp change within a half hour of taking it.

I didn't immediately cut out vegetables and beans b/c I didn't really believe that at first, but now I agree, and cut those out, aiming for less than 5g fiber a day (unless from carrot) which helped my digestion and feelings (and looks sometimes) of bloat.

But importantly you want to get high protein, at least 100g/day. You want to get it from dairy protein (casein), and gelatin or broth as much as possible. So, I eat tons of cheese and milk. Some eggs, less than 6 per week. I eat fruit snacks made from fruit juice and gelatin for sugar and a small bit of protein, and also orange juice for sugar. I'm really just following what Peat says. Personally, I find I can get away with some no-fiber wheat products like really white bread and water crackers, but not everyone will. Peat recommends potatoes if you cook them a lot, but I'm not sure I tolerate it, so test it for yourself. I can eat small amounts of white rice, like less than a half cup (after cooking!). I have mixed results with coconut oil, but I think it has to do with refined vs unrefined and am still trying to figure that out. OH! And Caffeine! Lots of coffee as long as your consuming adequate sugar! I am up to 800mg/day caffeine.

The mistake I made early was hitting ice cream too hard and I gained weight. It has lots of fat, and little protein, but will make you feel full, so will likely make you get too little protein, and protein supports your thyroid function. Basically, reducing fat and increasing protein and calcium and salt leans me out, and probably generally works for anyone. And once you get your temp up, don't be afraid of sugar. I think IF tends to make you scared of it, especially if your doing it with a paleo flavor as is common, but when you get your metabolism running right, you can just think of sugar as raw fuel that keeps you burning like a heat lamp rather than going to fat as is usually assumed.

WOW!
Thanks vary much DrJ! It really makes sense to me! I will ask you a favor: could you please post a typical day diet for you?

A little observation about potatoes in my case: This week i´ve been eating mashed potatoes at night and my sleep is terrible. I will cut out starches again. Its too much coincidence for me.
Question: What kind of juice fruit do you consume? Do you think a lemonade with sugar and a dash of salt would be good? (i think its easier than OJ).
Another question: What kind of cheese do you consume DrJ?
I will keep consuming coffe and i will up my protein intake. I found very pleasant to eat some beef with cheese to balance calcium/phosphate.

post 113516

post 113262 I really need to drop some fat and despite Peat-eating make me more stress-free im stucked with a belly fat

I think it will be hard to lose belly fat if you still consume whole milk and too much butter or creamed coffee, even with fasting.

Im starting to agree with you Westside PUFAs... Low carb and paleo made me lose the fear of fat, but i think fat is a really fattening thing.
Next week:
- Chew more food to reduce the caloric intake
- Increase protein (skim milk + cheese + beef)
- Increase salt
- Keep sugar ( coke + coffee + lemonade)
- Reduce fat

What do you guys think?

 

[DrJ]

post 113566 WOW!
Thanks vary much DrJ! It really makes sense to me! I will ask you a favor: could you please post a typical day diet for you?

A little observation about potatoes in my case: This week i´ve been eating mashed potatoes at night and my sleep is terrible. I will cut out starches again. Its too much coincidence for me.
Question: What kind of juice fruit do you consume? Do you think a lemonade with sugar and a dash of salt would be good? (i think its easier than OJ).
Another question: What kind of cheese do you consume DrJ?
I will keep consuming coffe and i will up my protein intake. I found very pleasant to eat some beef with cheese to balance calcium/phosphate.

Westside PUFAs wrote:
Source of the post
livrepensador wrote:
Source of the post I really need to drop some fat and despite Peat-eating make me more stress-free im stucked with a belly fat


I think it will be hard to lose belly fat if you still consume whole milk and too much butter or creamed coffee, even with fasting.


Im starting to agree with you Westside PUFAs... Low carb and paleo made me lose the fear of fat, but i think fat is a really fattening thing.

Sure...

Breakfast:
16oz 2% milk (lower fat I don't like taste): 240 cal, 16g protein
5oz cottage cheese, 120 cal, ~8g protein

Throughout day as I'm hungry/need caffeine:
Gelatin-based fruit snacks, 500-600 cal, 5-6g protein (when have time, make homemade, otherwise, you can find store bought, but they have some additives; for me, no problems; YMMV)
3-4 cups coffee
I also take caffeine pills to get to about 800mg caffeine/day, and still trying to get higher

Lunch:
I make a weekly soup to take for lunch! I notice broth makes my digestion work really well. I don't know how many calories this is, and I estimate protein. I generally avoid muscle meats, but sometimes okay, and with broth to balance out amino acid profile, Peat seems to think okay.
Soup is: beef broth, milk or cream, a little sausage and/or bacon, some potato (I cook this for 2 hours), ??? cal, ~20-30g protein
2x cheese sticks, 160cal, 16g protein
8 oz orange juice, 110cal, 1g protein

Snack:
8oz 2% milk, 120cal, 8g protein

Dinner:
Lots of cheese, usually on water crackers (if you tolerate), at least 8 oz, usually more like 12oz: ?? cal, 55-85g protein
16oz orange juice mixed with a little gelatin, 220+cal 6g protein

As you can see, I don't really count calories, or pay attention to my sugar/carb intake. I salt liberally. Besides regularly planned meals, I eat sugar when feel hungry, which is frequent, often from fruit snacks, but there's lots of other substitutes if you're in a pinch. Some days I will eat 1000+cal from fruit snacks or other sugary sources (Red bull ) and don't even think about it. But I would warn you want to make sure your metabolism is up before you get so cavalier with sugar, and caffeine helps. My skin is always very warm and temp is at least 97.5F. And I feel warm even out in cold weather for at least 30min before I feel like I need a jacket. I'm easily above 100g protein. Fiber is super low. Sometimes I drink piss-water beer like PBR or coors light! But that's not Peat. Sometimes you need a social life, though.

I honestly don't know about lemonade! It's too abrasive on my teeth so I stick with OJ. I eat cheddar, jack, mozzarella, parmesan, gouda. Parm is really low fat. Mozzarella not as much. You can mix and match to your preference.

 

[DrJ]

Oh, just to clear up some things I thought of. I will salt my cheese/water cracker dinner combo if I feel craving for salt. Any time I feel salt craving I will hit the salt hard. Potato content of soup is 2 potatoes for 5 days of soup, which I tolerate ok in that amount. I pan fry sausage and/or bacon in butter with either 3 clove garlic or 1/2 onion as the "flavor base" of soup, but note that garlic/onion is not really Peat, but it cooks for 2 hours and it's drowned in broth so probably not a big deal. You add the milk/half-and-half/or cream during the last 10 minutes and salt liberally at the end. The cheeses with holes, like Swiss or emantaler, messes me up so I avoid.

Importantly, too little fat will stop up my digestive system, so watch out for that. I think of it as too much protein in ratio to fat is "too dry" so there is a limit to how low fat I think works well, at least for my experience. Fat helps you produce bile which is key to digestion, so I don't think you want to go too low, just prefer the saturated fats (butter, milk fat).

I also supplement vitamins, and will post if you want. At this point I just count pills and will have to look up the actual amounts for you.

 

[livrepensador]

Thank you so much, DrJ!!!

 

[ThunderSpank]

Eat stop eat where you do 1-2 24 hour fasts per week and 16/8 fasts basically everyday ( and a few 36 hour fasts ) were all fantastic at dropping my temp down to the low 96's and giving me erectile dysfunction at the age of 20. I have lots of experience doing all three protocols and I personally will never willingly do them again.... EVER!

 

[EIRE24]

post 114467 Eat stop eat where you do 1-2 24 hour fasts per week and 16/8 fasts basically everyday ( and a few 36 hour fasts ) were all fantastic at dropping my temp down to the low 96's and giving me erectile dysfunction at the age of 20. I have lots of experience doing all three protocols and I personally will never willingly do them again.... EVER!

How are things looking for you now? Have you recovered?

 

[ThunderSpank]

post 114514

post 114467 Eat stop eat where you do 1-2 24 hour fasts per week and 16/8 fasts basically everyday ( and a few 36 hour fasts ) were all fantastic at dropping my temp down to the low 96's and giving me erectile dysfunction at the age of 20. I have lots of experience doing all three protocols and I personally will never willingly do them again.... EVER!

How are things looking for you now? Have you recovered?

Definitely!! My body and mind work even better than before I spent 3 years doing different Fasting protocols.

 

[EIRE24]

post 114557

post 114514

post 114467 Eat stop eat where you do 1-2 24 hour fasts per week and 16/8 fasts basically everyday ( and a few 36 hour fasts ) were all fantastic at dropping my temp down to the low 96's and giving me erectile dysfunction at the age of 20. I have lots of experience doing all three protocols and I personally will never willingly do them again.... EVER!

How are things looking for you now? Have you recovered?

Definitely!! My body and mind work even better than before I spent 3 years doing different Fasting protocols.

What helped you recover most? And what does your diet look like now?

 

[ThunderSpank]

post 114560

post 114557

post 114514

post 114467 Eat stop eat where you do 1-2 24 hour fasts per week and 16/8 fasts basically everyday ( and a few 36 hour fasts ) were all fantastic at dropping my temp down to the low 96's and giving me erectile dysfunction at the age of 20. I have lots of experience doing all three protocols and I personally will never willingly do them again.... EVER!

How are things looking for you now? Have you recovered?

Definitely!! My body and mind work even better than before I spent 3 years doing different Fasting protocols.

What helped you recover most? And what does your diet look like now?

I changed a lot at once but I believe carbohydrates regularly where a huge help. My diet for the last year plus has been low fat milk, chocolate, orange juice, carrot salad, liver and a few supplements. I'm currently changing my diet in a big way, but I brought my temps up etc with the diet I stated.

 

[maryjanexx]

I eat a 20-30-50 ratio with a late breakfast, lunch and dinner, simply for convenience. I find that a big dinner chills me out, whereas a light breakfast keeps me fresh. I know this topic is old, but this is similar to IF in that a majority of my calories are in one meal, after noon. Fat storage? Or vitality? I lost quite a bit of weight with this method previously, just wondering your thoughts.

Also, this method does not stress me out in the least because I have been eating this way since high school (2008ish).

 

[Wagner83]

Have any of you tried intermittent fasting for weight loss? 16 hours without eating, 8 hours to give your all is one way to do it.

 

[Giraffe]

@Wagner83, I moved your post above. It was off-topic in the orginal thread.

 

[tankasnowgod]

Have any of you tried intermittent fasting for weight loss? 16 hours without eating, 8 hours to give your all is one way to do it.

I did IF before my Peat days, and it was great for weight loss for a few months. In fact, it was the only thing I found to work, before using Colpo's Fat Loss Bible plan and a Fitbit. I did seem to run into some problems in the winter, and blamed IF, but looking back now, I'm not so sure. I was doing LOT'S of crazy things by that point, and I found out I was really high in iron, too.

I'm thinking of giving it a go, with a more "Peaty" approach (including plenty of carbs in the eating window). The more I've looked, the more that something like a 14-24 fast or so seems compatible with a lot of Peat's ideas, ASSUMING you're in pretty good health.

 

[Gl;itch.e]

I did IF before my Peat days, and it was great for weight loss for a few months. In fact, it was the only thing I found to work, before using Colpo's Fat Loss Bible plan and a Fitbit. I did seem to run into some problems in the winter, and blamed IF, but looking back now, I'm not so sure. I was doing LOT'S of crazy things by that point, and I found out I was really high in iron, too.

I'm thinking of giving it a go, with a more "Peaty" approach (including plenty of carbs in the eating window). The more I've looked, the more that something like a 14-24 fast or so seems compatible with a lot of Peat's ideas, ASSUMING you're in pretty good health.

Let us know how you go. I am also considering this myself. I had good results (with fat loss) doing a lean gains style fasting diet. If I did it the same today I would tweak a few things to make it more "peaty" and I think I would still have excellent fatloss while mitigating too much damage.

 

[Constatine]

I did IF before my Peat days, and it was great for weight loss for a few months. In fact, it was the only thing I found to work, before using Colpo's Fat Loss Bible plan and a Fitbit. I did seem to run into some problems in the winter, and blamed IF, but looking back now, I'm not so sure. I was doing LOT'S of crazy things by that point, and I found out I was really high in iron, too.

I'm thinking of giving it a go, with a more "Peaty" approach (including plenty of carbs in the eating window). The more I've looked, the more that something like a 14-24 fast or so seems compatible with a lot of Peat's ideas, ASSUMING you're in pretty good health.

Fasting does have its benefits but one must be sure to not undereat and not to fast too often. The problem is when one takes fasting too extreme and calls it a lifestyle. The human body can grow stronger from stressors, but not chronic stress.

 

[sladerunner69]

I wouldnt recommend fasting to anyone sufering from hairloss or pattern baldness... Fasting may help one lose weight but it will definitely increase stress hormones at the same time...

 

[Westside PUFAs]

I wouldnt recommend fasting to anyone sufering from hairloss or pattern baldness... Fasting may help one lose weight but it will definitely increase stress hormones at the same time...

Kinobody is an avid faster and has perfect hair: