The Christ Within

[damngoodcoffee]

A Satanist would believe free will is to follow your desires, aka hedonism.

From a Abrahamic perspective free will is the ability to choose right or wrong independent of context, whether it feels good or satisfies a man's own desires doesn't matter.

It is like saying why are drugs bad? Are they bad because it goes against God's will and is immoral, or are they bad because we can't sustain humanity with it?
For example imagine you have infinite food and shelter. Infinite drug supply. Would you be on meth 24/7 as long as it made you feel good? So the only reason then to not be on it is because of material limitation, not because you have any morality.

This is the difference between a Satanic ideal and an Abrahamic one. Free will certainly exists. And my example may seem extravagant but you can't imagine how many people would fall under my example of hedonism given the right circumstances. Then the whole idea of "the god within oneself" promoted by the New Age is wrong, because how can God be so wrong to mislead you?

It is always us vs the devil.

Your view of morality seems vain. I reject any view of morality as an abstract commandment you have to blindly follow. To me the only morality is something with logic, something which is building towards the well-being of all. You can't just say drugs are immoral because God said so. Lol what? Authoritarian superstitious nonsense. Drugs are immoral if they are bad for your health and if the production and distribution of them involves needless suffering. That's morality.

I'd say it's impossible to be moral without following your desires. How do you even know what's right and what's wrong? Do you base it only on what other people tell you some other people wrote down perfectly ordained by God?

You need to follow your desires and analyze the results to be truly moral. To me that's a part of real morality. Having the balls and the humility to make your own mistakes and learn from them.

To me the arrogance of thinking that you have a free will to choose good is more satanic than any hedonism. And don't tell me you "choosing good" (whatever that means to you) doesn't satisfy your deep desires, even if the chosen "good" momentarily is inconvenient. I bet it tickles your prideful desire to be perfect for God quite a bit.

To be honest I can't think of anything more satanic than thinking that you can choose good by your own will power.

You're smart enough to choose Jesus while other idiots burn forever! Most Christians believe they save themselves by choosing Jesus but they are real talented in self-deception.

 

[Perry Staltic]

Funny fact: If I pass a church with a sign out front that says "Free Will Baptist Church" I read "Freewheeling Baptist Church" just because it's funny.

 

[Perry Staltic]

Your view of morality seems vain. I reject any view of morality as an abstract commandment you have to blindly follow. To me the only morality is something with logic, something which is building towards the well-being of all. You can't just say drugs are immoral because God said so. Lol what? Authoritarian superstitious nonsense. Drugs are immoral if they are bad for your health and if the production and distribution of them involves needless suffering. That's morality.

God never said any such thing (that I know of). He did say love your neighbor as yourself, which means we are commanded to love ourselves. If drugs cause us to harm ourselves or others, that's not loving. If they don't then drug use is between a person and God

 

[Perry Staltic]

To be honest I can't think of anything more satanic than thinking that you can choose good by your own will power.

You're either confusing the ability to choose to do good with the ability to do good, or you're making a ridiculous statement. To the former, Paul described this conundrum and its solution quite clearly in the book of Romans; to the latter, it's simply ridiculous to consider a person satanic for choosing for conscience's sake to not do evil to a person who he wants to be evil towards.

 

[EustaceBagge]

Your view of morality seems vain. I reject any view of morality as an abstract commandment you have to blindly follow. To me the only morality is something with logic, something which is building towards the well-being of all. You can't just say drugs are immoral because God said so. Lol what? Authoritarian superstitious nonsense. Drugs are immoral if they are bad for your health and if the production and distribution of them involves needless suffering. That's morality.

Morality that is ordained by God is not an abstract commandment you blindly follow. God created us and knows what is best for us. God doesn't profit from me being good, and me being naughty doesn't hurt or impact God.

You need to follow your desires and analyze the results to be truly moral. To me that's a part of real morality. Having the balls and the humility to make your own mistakes and learn from them.

This is more narrow minded than you claim me to be. Why can't I observe the results of others decision and their results and learn from their mistakes? If my desire wants to hurt someone it doesn't mean I should do it yet here we are, a lot of people respect others safespace.

You're smart enough to choose Jesus while other idiots burn forever! Most Christians believe they save themselves by choosing Jesus but they are real talented in self-deception.

It is not choosing Jesus, it is choosing the allmighty. In this sense it is superior, yes. How can you claim any other being to be superior to God, with God being one and above all?

God never said any such thing (that I know of). He did say love your neighbor as yourself, which means we are commanded to love ourselves. If drugs cause us to harm ourselves or others, that's not loving. If they don't then drug use is between a person and God

Intoxicating the spirit is something not to be taken lightly. You think in material terms.

 

[Perry Staltic]

Intoxicating the spirit is something not to be taken lightly. You think in material terms.

What in the world does this mean? Drugs intoxicate the flesh, not the spirit.

 

[EustaceBagge]

What in the world does this mean? Drugs intoxicate the flesh, not the spirit.

When someone is drunk, what remains is the flesh not the spirit. Which one gets intoxicated?

 

[Perry Staltic]

I'd say it's impossible to be moral without following your desires. How do you even know what's right and what's wrong? Do you base it only on what other people tell you some other people wrote down perfectly ordained by God?

It all boils down to whether you are taught of God or not. Jesus said all who are taught of the father will come to him and all who will to do God's will will know whether the words others' speak (ie doctrine) are of God or of those speaking

 

[damngoodcoffee]

it's simply ridiculous to consider a person satanic for choosing for conscience's sake to not do evil to a person who he wants to be evil towards.

I'm saying it's satanic to view that part of yourself that makes that decision as separate from God.

 

[Perry Staltic]

When someone is drunk, what remains is the flesh not the spirit. Which one gets intoxicated?

All alcohol does is weaken a person's ability to make the right choices

 

[Perry Staltic]

I'm saying it's satanic to view that part of yourself that makes that decision as separate from God.

Who is saying this besides you? Is this an impression you got from your upbringing?

 

[EustaceBagge]

I'm saying it's satanic to view that part of yourself that makes that decision as separate from God.

It is not satanic. The decision you make is seperate from God, the result is not seperate from God as that rests with God's will. Your will makes your intent, the end result of course depends on God's will. God's will includes you having the will to choose for yourself.

God lets us will, but the result of course is on him.

Man judges actions, God judges intentions. God knows best.

 

[damngoodcoffee]

Who is saying this besides you? Is this an impression you got from your upbringing?

Umm.. You. Free will.

 

[Perry Staltic]

Umm.. You. Free will.

You seem to think that having the ability to act contrary to God's will is the same thing as acting against God's will. The former is the ability to choose, the latter is an action or deed. Or possibly you think that will and desires are the same thing; they're not. If a person desires to do evil towards someone yet chooses (wills) not to because he wants to do God's will, he has chosen by his will to not do something that would separate him from God (ie sin). Conversely, if that person follows his desires rather than God's will (ie, love others as yourself), he does a sinful deed that separates him from God.

 

[Blossom]

@Inaut, Have you thought about re-reading Orthodoxy and The Religion of The Future by Fr. Seraphim Rose by chance?

 

[tankasnowgod]

It is like saying why are drugs bad? Are they bad because it goes against God's will and is immoral, or are they bad because we can't sustain humanity with it?
For example imagine you have infinite food and shelter. Infinite drug supply. Would you be on meth 24/7 as long as it made you feel good? So the only reason then to not be on it is because of material limitation, not because you have any morality.

This is such a silly example and conclusion for a number of reasons. First off, meth (and pretty much any other recreational or street drug) does not make you feel "good" after continuous use. You would likely feel pretty lousy after an initial high. And anyone who decided to do meth "24/7" would be dead in very short order, probably within a few days, but most certainly, by the end of the month.

The other thing that's ridiculous about the example is that many people do stimulant drugs like meth to work multiple jobs, to support themselves and/or their family. Drugs like meth are most common in places like San Francisco and Hawaii, where many people have to work unsustainable hours to get by, like 80-100 hour weeks or more. Forget "infinite," if everyone in the world just had adequate food and shelter, along with zero debt, the use of stimulant drugs in general would be far, far less, and meth in particular (which makes you people feel lousy more than it ever makes them feel "good") would be drastically lower.

In those cases, meth certainly isn't a "good" choice, but it's not done out of pure hedonism, or even pure selfishness.

This is the difference between a Satanic ideal and an Abrahamic one. Free will certainly exists. And my example may seem extravagant but you can't imagine how many people would fall under my example of hedonism given the right circumstances. Then the whole idea of "the god within oneself" promoted by the New Age is wrong, because how can God be so wrong to mislead you?

It is always us vs the devil.

Wait, isn't Abraham the one who first mutilated his son's genitals (and promoted the horrific practice to future generations)? It might be one thing for a 99 year old man to do such a thing to himself, to enter into a covenant with some powerful entity. But, it is quite another to do this to a 13 year old child, or an infant minutes to days after birth. I think there is a lot of dark stuff in the Old Testament, and I don't think many of the commands of The Elohim are "good" in any sense of the word. Circumcision is the prime example. Even today, that barbaric practice leads to the deaths of at least 100 babies a year in the US, and that is using modern, sterile equipment.

https://bestdoulas.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/06/circdeathrisk.pdf

Lost Boys

Baby boys can and do succumb as a result of having their foreskin removed. Circumcision-related mortality rates are not known with certainty; this study estimates the scale of this problem. This study finds that approximately 117 neonatal circumcision-related deaths (9.01/100,000) occur annually...

www.berghahnjournals.com

Baby boys can and do succumb as a result of having their foreskin removed. Circumcision-related mortality rates are not known with certainty; this study estimates the scale of this problem. This study finds that approximately 117 neonatal circumcision-related deaths (9.01/100,000) occur annually in the United States, about 1.3% of male neonatal deaths from all causes. Because infant circumcision is elective, all of these deaths are avoidable. This study also identifies reasons why accurate data on these deaths are not available, some of the obstacles to preventing these deaths, and some solutions to overcome them.

In another thread, people claimed that there was no way that Jepthath sacrificed his daughter to Jehovah as a burnt offering, despite the fact that Judges 11:31-40 says he "fulfilled his vow," and his vow came to mean use his only daughter as a burnt offering. But, I don't see why Jehovah or the Elohim in general would have a problem with Jepthath sacrificing his daughter, as there has been an open support of barbaric procedure that can and does lead to infant deaths, even in the modern day with superior sterile equipment, and thousands of years of practice.

Fact of the matter is, this practice still goes on today, and while demon doctors who do these mutilations may not have a covenant with any entity but their various medical boards and government agencies, it's still something supposedly sanctioned (or required) by God. If you want to know what my biggest problem is with Christianity (or any of the Abrahamic religions), this is it. Even if it is no longer "required" of Christians, as Paul stated, it's still tolerated. And I don't think it should be, at least not for those too young to consent or understand or fight back against such a procedure.

 

[milomag]

Who wrote or "authored" the KJB @milomag? Pretty sure it wasn't King James.,,

God inspired and preserved the Authorized King James Bible. The devil attacks God's word by way of putting out many corrupted, counterfeit so-called "bibles", but all those modern versions add, subtract, and change God's pure words. All modern perversions have mistakes in them. The way to know which Bible is the one God wrote is to find the one without mistakes in it....the Authorized King James Bible.

 

[tankasnowgod]

God inspired and preserved the Authorized King James Bible. The devil attacks God's word by way of putting out many corrupted, counterfeit so-called "bibles", but all those modern versions add, subtract, and change God's pure words. All modern perversions have mistakes in them. The way to know which Bible is the one God wrote is to find the one without mistakes in it....the Authorized King James Bible.

The copyright for the King James version is still held by the Crown in England.

 

[EustaceBagge]

This is such a silly example and conclusion for a number of reasons. First off, meth (and pretty much any other recreational or street drug) does not make you feel "good" after continuous use. You would likely feel pretty lousy after an initial high. And anyone who decided to do meth "24/7" would be dead in very short order, probably within a few days, but most certainly, by the end of the month.

The other thing that's ridiculous about the example is that many people do stimulant drugs like meth to work multiple jobs, to support themselves and/or their family. Drugs like meth are most common in places like San Francisco and Hawaii, where many people have to work unsustainable hours to get by, like 80-100 hour weeks or more. Forget "infinite," if everyone in the world just had adequate food and shelter, along with zero debt, the use of stimulant drugs in general would be far, far less, and meth in particular (which makes you people feel lousy more than it ever makes them feel "good") would be drastically lower.

In those cases, meth certainly isn't a "good" choice, but it's not done out of pure hedonism, or even pure selfishness.

Drugs are always done out of hedonism, except medical usage where it is rightfully used as a painkiller.

Wait, isn't Abraham the one who first mutilated his son's genitals (and promoted the horrific practice to future generations)? It might be one thing for a 99 year old man to do such a thing to himself, to enter into a covenant with some powerful entity. But, it is quite another to do this to a 13 year old child, or an infant minutes to days after birth. I think there is a lot of dark stuff in the Old Testament, and I don't think many of the commands of The Elohim are "good" in any sense of the word. Circumcision is the prime example. Even today, that barbaric practice leads to the deaths of at least 100 babies a year in the US, and that is using modern, sterile equipment.

Circumcision may be bad or good. My point is that the Abrahamic ideal includes having free will.

In another thread, people claimed that there was no way that Jepthath sacrificed his daughter to Jehovah as a burnt offering, despite the fact that Judges 11:31-40 says he "fulfilled his vow," and his vow came to mean use his only daughter as a burnt offering. But, I don't see why Jehovah or the Elohim in general would have a problem with Jepthath sacrificing his daughter, as there has been an open support of barbaric procedure that can and does lead to infant deaths, even in the modern day with superior sterile equipment, and thousands of years of practice.

Fact of the matter is, this practice still goes on today, and while demon doctors who do these mutilations may not have a covenant with any entity but their various medical boards and government agencies, it's still something supposedly sanctioned (or required) by God. If you want to know what my biggest problem is with Christianity (or any of the Abrahamic religions), this is it. Even if it is no longer "required" of Christians, as Paul stated, it's still tolerated. And I don't think it should be, at least not for those too young to consent or understand or fight back against such a procedure.

This is exactly what I implied with my first post.

You people take Christian elements for your own faux beliefs and larp as Christians while not believing in the Bible at all. Why tarnish the name of Christ with your weird ideals if you don't believe in the Bible anyway? You might as well take the name of your favourite author, what is the difference if you are not a Christian? God does not necessarily have to be called Christ you know? Knowingly or unknowingly your a heretic. And I'm not even Christian, I just despise hippies and New Age larpers that don't know what they are doing. Inb4 you reply with "you don't know what your doing let me tell you why".

 

[charlie]

The way to know which Bible is the one God wrote is to find the one without mistakes in it....the Authorized King James Bible.

The King James is the best we have, unless you go the the original manuscripts. However, there are some mistakes in it, but nothing too bad. You can even read the letter in the beginning of the King James and basically they say they are human and probably made some mistakes. They did, but like I said, its the best we got right now.

God put a "fence" around the word, so it would get through even till this day. If you know, you know.