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Blossom, do you see any risk of overdoing it with a CO2 bag? What kind of adverse reaction can you envisage? I'll try it out with someone else here the first time, just in case sth goes wrong (eg I fall asleep and can't get myself out of trouble). ThanksBlossom said:Personally I think bag breathing, breath holds and even CO2 or baking soda bathing would be the safer choice. Although it is exceedingly rare with healthy lungs people can over do it on CO2 especially if attempting to breath it directly from a 100% CO2 source such as a tank. I plan on getting a tank myself and I really appreciate the value of CO2 but I also respect the power of this substance to potentially cause problems in unnaturally high amounts. I'm the last one to be fear mongering but CO2 optimization should always be taken slow (IMO).
@tara-will you be rebreathing your own CO2 in a paper bag or are you filling a bag with CO2 from a tank? j. is absolutely correct about paying attention to your bodies feed back but you will be getting more CO2 in a shorter amount of time if it is coming from a 100% CO2 source rather than simply breathing your own CO2. I was under the impression that Peat had used CO2 as a body treatment by filling a plastic bag with CO2 and sealing the bag at his neck. I'm not aware of any recommendations to breathe CO2 from tank, but could be wrong. Rebreathing our own CO2 insures a gradual increase but breathing it from a tank of 100% CO2 seems like it might be somewhat risky like breathing 100% oxygen. We need both no doubt but at a certain point both can be toxic if applied too quickly and in too large of a concentration. I'm not one to discourage experimentation and we all have to do what best for our own context but CO2 does regulate our breathing so I think gradually increasing it is always the safest option and listening to our bodies feedback as j. pointed out. Good luck!tara said:Blossom, do you see any risk of overdoing it with a CO2 bag? What kind of adverse reaction can you envisage? I'll try it out with someone else here the first time, just in case sth goes wrong (eg I fall asleep and can't get myself out of trouble). ThanksBlossom said:Personally I think bag breathing, breath holds and even CO2 or baking soda bathing would be the safer choice. Although it is exceedingly rare with healthy lungs people can over do it on CO2 especially if attempting to breath it directly from a 100% CO2 source such as a tank. I plan on getting a tank myself and I really appreciate the value of CO2 but I also respect the power of this substance to potentially cause problems in unnaturally high amounts. I'm the last one to be fear mongering but CO2 optimization should always be taken slow (IMO).
I'm not planning to breath extra CO2 more than minor incidental leakage. I plan to sit in it, possibly up to neck, in a plastic mattress bag. I'm hoping paying attention to how I feel with this method will prevent me going too far. What I most fear is that it could trigger migraine, but I've read that it helps relieve them for some people. Does this look risky to you?Blossom said:@tara-will you be rebreathing your own CO2 in a paper bag or are you filling a bag with CO2 from a tank?
mas said:I am now seeing how important this CO2 is and bag breathe daily...
You can purchase CO2 flowmeter regulators on eBay.BingDing said:Just to clarify my post about breathing CO2, I take several breaths of air between hits of CO2. Like those chickens show, breathing pure CO2 only is dangerous. I started by just using tiny blasts of CO2 and gradually increased. As long as I breathe air in between hits I feel pretty safe.
I talked to a medical supply house about it and they don't sell to the public, only through a doctor. I wanted to find a demand regulator like a scuba regulator and meter small amounts of CO2 into the airstream, but couldn't find it. Maybe we'll find an enlightened respiratory therapist to help us out.
Tara, former forum member Peatrian was one of the most experienced (and helpful) members ever. She would stay in a bag up to her neck for hours, reading or watching TV. And there are spas in Europe with CO2 baths. So I think you'll be fine. Searching for that thread may be useful.
I tried it one time with my legs in a bag and it wasn't too successful. I was by myself and the CO2 mixed with the air in the bag, and I had a hard time sealing the top. Having someone to help would make a big difference (and I have to admit my effort was sorta lame).
Good luck!
Some regulators have flowmeters and some do not. The flowmeter attachment allows for adjusting the CO2 flow between 1-25 liters typically. It is a cylindrical piece that is numbered and has a sort of dial on the side that moves a ball inside the cylinder to the desired flow. 1 liter of flow would be equivalent to 3-4% CO2. You can Google flowmeters to see if your regulator has this attachment.bradley said:I have a tank and regulator, but can't figure out a reliable/measured way to make a 5%-7% greater mixture with air.
bradley said:I have a tank and regulator, but can't figure out a reliable/measured way to make a 5%-7% greater mixture with air.
The CO2 that worked for the divers was higher because the were at a very low altitude. It can be thought of as exactly the opposite of the ideal high altitude scenario where our body retains CO2. That's just how I make sense of it. Atmospheric pressure plays a huge role in the pressure of the gasses in our bodies. I don't think I would try to achieve a inspired CO2 level equivalent to what a scuba diver could handle, when under water, while on land. It seems like comparing apples and oranges.BingDing said:bradley said:I have a tank and regulator, but can't figure out a reliable/measured way to make a 5%-7% greater mixture with air.
Man, but I know what you mean. In the CO2 video Ray talks about Navy divers breathing carbogen for hours. At least one version of carbogen is 20% CO2 and 80% pure O2. Way too radical for us, of course, but it brings to mind the idea of enhancing air with CO2 in the tank; then we could just breathe it straight from the tank and not asphyxiate ourselves.
I never asked the local gas company if they would do it, someone has to figure out just what 5% CO2 means and how to concoct such a mixture. The counter guy at a welding supply shop isn't going to know. Meh.
Blossom, a flowmeter would be a piece of the puzzle, thanks. But we still need a system. You seem to be familiar with cannulas and those O2 systems, can you explain how it works?
Well, now that I think about it I can guess how it works. The tank of gas is connected to the flow meter and then to the nose piece. As you breathe through the nose a metered amount of supplemental gas is inhaled with air. We just have to know what flow rate approximates 5-7%.
Shoot, hiding in a closet and bag breathing is sounding pretty attractive, LOL.