Hello all,
My temps are still low despite taking a pretty hefty daily dose of cynomel and cynoplus. I commenced use in c. March 2023 (3 months ago) on a pretty low dose (10mcg T3, 20mcg T4 - 1/6 of a cynomel and cynoplus), and gradually, gradually increased the dose over time. I was advised by the D-Rod (at least, to my understanding) to gradually increase the dose 'til I saw a relief in symptoms - staying on the same dose for at least 2-3 weeks before increasing as needed, or possibly even a touch longer, to ensure that I did not tip into hyper-.
I have just recently increased the dose to what is now a pretty hefty sum (c. 30mcg T3 and 90mcg T4) - almost complete thyroid replacement - but am observing low temps.
TIMELINE
I basically went: 1/6 of both a cynomel and a cynoplus tab, to 1/4, to 1/3, to 1/2, and now pushing cynoplus (the t3/t4 combo) even higher to 3/4.
When I first moved up to c. 1/4 to 1/3 of each, I noticed a pretty good increase in temperatures within a week or so. Some indications from March:
Things were looking good temperature-wise. However, I did not notice any meaningful improvements in any of my hypo- symptoms at all... being: dry brittle hair, hair falling out, puffy face / puffy eyes and water retention, low energy / lethargy / tired all the time, poor digestion, poor sexual function, cold hands / feet / nose and other circulation issues (leg veins don't look healthy - not varicose yet, but don't look to be flowing well), other estrogenic symptoms (gyno c. the size of grapes, hips, spider veins beginning in places), terrible vitiligo, and many more.
I spoke to the D-Rod way back in March to say basically that "my temps seem to have increased quite nicely, but none of my symptoms are improving... what gives?" To which I was given the advice (to my understanding): "dose to treat symptoms, not just temps" i.e. if I still have hypo- symptoms (on the comparatively low dose of 1 grain that I was on) then I may still need to increase the dose (i.e. system still did not have adequate thyroid hormone).
So this is exactly what I did. Gradually, gradually increased the dose making sure not to tip into hyper-... only now I am at almost complete thyroid replacement, with very little improvement to any hypo- symptoms.
I started taking temps again in the past couple of weeks and am back in the low 97s, which is exactly where I was prior to thyroid replacement. This morning's reading:
and this was after a few tries - even got a 96.9.
Any advice on why this could be? I think this needs to be cracked before I will ever start to feel better.
Current Areas of Investigation:
Gut Health
- Possibly not absorbing the thyroid I am ingesting for some reason... Possibly low grade gut infection / endotoxin... antibiotics?? I have 2 weeks worth of doxycycline (in the UK, I had to tell the pharmacy I had chlamydia to get them - thanks for the tip @Herbie ! hahaha) , but am unsure whether to take them for two reasons: (1) they could upset the balance of the gut and allow the more resistant bacteria to take hold, leading to worse problems. (2) they can actually worsen mitochondrial function, and hence, metabolism (not sure how short vs. long term this impact would be).
Not sure what else it could be...
I have searched the forum and found a few threads with similar issues - but it seems to be a highly individual thing and difficult to find a "protocol" of things to check for.
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Other Guides:
PROFILE
32M, 180lbs (82kg), 6 ft 1 (186cm), c. 12-15% body fat
FOOD
I eat pretty similarly every day. Approx:
- 1/2 lb / 250g of meat (usually beef) (c. 500kcal)
- 500ml goat milk (c. 300kcal)
- 2 eggs (c. 150kcal)
- 1 oz / 30g cheese (I can't digest any more than that - constipation) (c. 125kcal)
- 25g beef gelatin
- c. 300g well-cooked potatoes and white rice with my evening meal (c. 300kcal)
- OJ, Cola, honey, gummies / other sugar delivery mechanism ad libitum - I'd say at least 1.5L of juice / cola and whatever, plus minimum 100g sweet sugars (c. 1000kcal BARE minimum - more like 1500kcal)
- A bunch of extra table sugar in. milk etc. (c. 50-100g of table sugar) (200-400kcal)
- Random pickings / grazing at other things - prawns, sausages, vanilla ice cream, fruit (grapes) whatever takes my fancy
- Calves liver once per 1-2 weeks (I can't find good liverwurst to have a small amount daily), occasional oysters
I would say c. 3000kcal is a good estimate, but I don't really measure (the above is an estimate) and never think about portion control anymore. I don't force-feed, but I don't restrict. When I'm hungry, I eat.
MOVEMENT
Fairly sedentary throughout the day. Lots of WFH. At least one gentle walk outside daily though. I also do one single set of one weight lifting exercise every day (Monday Chinups, Tuesday Shoulder Press, Wednesday Lunge etc. etc.) - muscles are being worked, but very low volume and 1 week to recover.
SLEEP
My sleep is not great tbh. I often get to bed too late (old habits die hard), and can take some time to get to sleep. However, I always sleep through the night and always wake up without an alarm. Never wake up feeling rested though.
SUPPS
Thyroid, Fat solubles: D3 (3000IU), K2 (2mg), experimenting with small amounts of vitamin E (100IU max)
My temps are still low despite taking a pretty hefty daily dose of cynomel and cynoplus. I commenced use in c. March 2023 (3 months ago) on a pretty low dose (10mcg T3, 20mcg T4 - 1/6 of a cynomel and cynoplus), and gradually, gradually increased the dose over time. I was advised by the D-Rod (at least, to my understanding) to gradually increase the dose 'til I saw a relief in symptoms - staying on the same dose for at least 2-3 weeks before increasing as needed, or possibly even a touch longer, to ensure that I did not tip into hyper-.
I have just recently increased the dose to what is now a pretty hefty sum (c. 30mcg T3 and 90mcg T4) - almost complete thyroid replacement - but am observing low temps.
TIMELINE
I basically went: 1/6 of both a cynomel and a cynoplus tab, to 1/4, to 1/3, to 1/2, and now pushing cynoplus (the t3/t4 combo) even higher to 3/4.
When I first moved up to c. 1/4 to 1/3 of each, I noticed a pretty good increase in temperatures within a week or so. Some indications from March:
Things were looking good temperature-wise. However, I did not notice any meaningful improvements in any of my hypo- symptoms at all... being: dry brittle hair, hair falling out, puffy face / puffy eyes and water retention, low energy / lethargy / tired all the time, poor digestion, poor sexual function, cold hands / feet / nose and other circulation issues (leg veins don't look healthy - not varicose yet, but don't look to be flowing well), other estrogenic symptoms (gyno c. the size of grapes, hips, spider veins beginning in places), terrible vitiligo, and many more.
I spoke to the D-Rod way back in March to say basically that "my temps seem to have increased quite nicely, but none of my symptoms are improving... what gives?" To which I was given the advice (to my understanding): "dose to treat symptoms, not just temps" i.e. if I still have hypo- symptoms (on the comparatively low dose of 1 grain that I was on) then I may still need to increase the dose (i.e. system still did not have adequate thyroid hormone).
So this is exactly what I did. Gradually, gradually increased the dose making sure not to tip into hyper-... only now I am at almost complete thyroid replacement, with very little improvement to any hypo- symptoms.
I started taking temps again in the past couple of weeks and am back in the low 97s, which is exactly where I was prior to thyroid replacement. This morning's reading:
Any advice on why this could be? I think this needs to be cracked before I will ever start to feel better.
Current Areas of Investigation:
Gut Health
- Possibly not absorbing the thyroid I am ingesting for some reason... Possibly low grade gut infection / endotoxin... antibiotics?? I have 2 weeks worth of doxycycline (in the UK, I had to tell the pharmacy I had chlamydia to get them - thanks for the tip @Herbie ! hahaha) , but am unsure whether to take them for two reasons: (1) they could upset the balance of the gut and allow the more resistant bacteria to take hold, leading to worse problems. (2) they can actually worsen mitochondrial function, and hence, metabolism (not sure how short vs. long term this impact would be).
Not sure what else it could be...
I have searched the forum and found a few threads with similar issues - but it seems to be a highly individual thing and difficult to find a "protocol" of things to check for.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Other Guides:
PROFILE
32M, 180lbs (82kg), 6 ft 1 (186cm), c. 12-15% body fat
FOOD
I eat pretty similarly every day. Approx:
- 1/2 lb / 250g of meat (usually beef) (c. 500kcal)
- 500ml goat milk (c. 300kcal)
- 2 eggs (c. 150kcal)
- 1 oz / 30g cheese (I can't digest any more than that - constipation) (c. 125kcal)
- 25g beef gelatin
- c. 300g well-cooked potatoes and white rice with my evening meal (c. 300kcal)
- OJ, Cola, honey, gummies / other sugar delivery mechanism ad libitum - I'd say at least 1.5L of juice / cola and whatever, plus minimum 100g sweet sugars (c. 1000kcal BARE minimum - more like 1500kcal)
- A bunch of extra table sugar in. milk etc. (c. 50-100g of table sugar) (200-400kcal)
- Random pickings / grazing at other things - prawns, sausages, vanilla ice cream, fruit (grapes) whatever takes my fancy
- Calves liver once per 1-2 weeks (I can't find good liverwurst to have a small amount daily), occasional oysters
I would say c. 3000kcal is a good estimate, but I don't really measure (the above is an estimate) and never think about portion control anymore. I don't force-feed, but I don't restrict. When I'm hungry, I eat.
MOVEMENT
Fairly sedentary throughout the day. Lots of WFH. At least one gentle walk outside daily though. I also do one single set of one weight lifting exercise every day (Monday Chinups, Tuesday Shoulder Press, Wednesday Lunge etc. etc.) - muscles are being worked, but very low volume and 1 week to recover.
SLEEP
My sleep is not great tbh. I often get to bed too late (old habits die hard), and can take some time to get to sleep. However, I always sleep through the night and always wake up without an alarm. Never wake up feeling rested though.
SUPPS
Thyroid, Fat solubles: D3 (3000IU), K2 (2mg), experimenting with small amounts of vitamin E (100IU max)