The Relationship between Prolactin and Dietary Calcium

[milk_lover]

Does increasing dietary calcium from dairy or eggshells or any calcium supplement help to lower prolactin? I've seen some articles online that talks about some people having high calcium in their blood and high prolactin.. I know from reading Ray Peat related articles that PTH hormone is responsible for increasing calcium in the blood from destroying bones. Any chance PTH and prolactin have any sort of relationship?
I want to find natural solutions to decrease prolactin as much as possible. After I have sex, I drink about 3/4th quart of milk and I take cold shower because I read somewhere that cold water decreases prolactin. I am not sure if those are effective methods. Vitamin B6 helps but I don't like supplements. I want to lower prolactin through food.

 

[Nicholas]

you BALANCE prolactin by regulating blood sugar. (through food) If you look at prolactin (or anything else internally) as something you have to lower or raise you will always be confused about the body. in short, regulating blood sugar is *meeting the demands of your body.* You regulate blood sugar by eating digestible foods, eating enough food, enough food frequently enough, eating your ideal ratio of protein/fat/carbs, and applying basic balancing of nutrients (i.e. basic amino acid balancing, basic mineral balancing, basic calcium/phosphorous balancing, and getting all the basic vitamins). This is the first and most important way of manipulating blood sugar in meeting your body where it is right now. Other factors of your life can decrease these efforts which may need attention as well - but only AFTER you've come to conclusions about how to regulate your blood sugar with food. Often the effort of food alone can help you to meet the demands of your life without having to make too many changes in your life.

If you are looking for a specific food to lower prolactin you are basically looking at the body through the lense of "supplementation" and this will not get you anywhere. Sorry - trying to be as clear and direct as possible because i have gotten a couple complaints that i'm not clear enough.

Of course you are more than welcome to do whatever you want with your body, and anyone can find short-term improvements by manipulating one aspect of their body..but the big question is will you come back in three weeks asking how to lower or raise something else? This is an intellectual vicious cycle of confusion that is the result of never understanding what health is.

 

[milk_lover]

Nicholas, thanks for taking your time to write and insight us with the true meaning of health.. You are such a savior to all of us, stupid people.

 

[jimmyquick]

https://raypeatforum.com/forums/posts/96514/ Does increasing dietary calcium from dairy or eggshells or any calcium supplement help to lower prolactin? I've seen some articles online that talks about some people having high calcium in their blood and high prolactin.. I know from reading Ray Peat related articles that PTH hormone is responsible for increasing calcium in the blood from destroying bones. Any chance PTH and prolactin have any sort of relationship?
I want to find natural solutions to decrease prolactin as much as possible. After I have sex, I drink about 3/4th quart of milk and I take cold shower because I read somewhere that cold water decreases prolactin. I am not sure if those are effective methods. Vitamin B6 helps but I don't like supplements. I want to lower prolactin through food.

In my experience, calcium intake did not change prolactin on my lab test. My first labs show high blood calcium, low PTH, low vit D, (and im outside everyday and tan) but high prolactin. Soon after the test, I drank up to a gallon of milk a day for a month and got re-tested. Prolactin near the same, blood calcium even higher and PTH and vit D even lower. My PTH was almost nil. It appears the higher the calcium intake the lower the PTH as most already know. But Im not sure if the high prolactin causes the high blood calcium or just a deficiency in something else that allows calcium to be out of control such as mag or vit k and then prolactin comes into play.

I recently had a discussion with Brain where he pointed out high prolactin seems to be an energy deficiency in the brain so anything that increase ATP should essentially lower prolactin. Im finding this to be true as magnesium has been extremely helpful with the calcium issue (no more heart palpitations, less anxiety, more energy and less of the head prolactin feel). So for this time around I've bumped up the mag, lowered the calcium and will get blood test soon and report on the prolactin.

My guess would be maybe try get adequate mag with your calcium (or high mag containing food) and see if you notice a difference.

 

[milk_lover]

Thank you Jimmy :) It will be interesting to see what upping magnesium does to your prolactin in the next test.. I can't wait and good luck.. Magnesium is very much related to ATP from what I've seen online. And if your theory is correct about prolactin being related to ATP, you could be on the right track and I hope you are :)

 

[pboy]

I'm not a pro with understanding prolactin at all, in the latest peat interview he mentions it being similar to growth hormone, and it prevents the cells ability to oxidize glucose all the way to Co2 (making lactic acid instead) and its a common feature of aging brains. I forget the mechanisms as to why that happens...he briefly touches on it though. I assume though that yea, increasing energy production would reverse its dominant effect, however, it itself causes lower energy so its kinda just a back and forth thing. I wanna say he is talking about the cholinergic system and how basically the more you go towards a futile state of living, the more those 2 stress signals are triggered (GH and prolactin) where as the more adventurous or enriched your environment, the less those are triggered, cause the acetylcholine is kept in its narrow control pathways. I'm sure its more complicated but tahts one way at least to trigger it

 

[milk_lover]

Interesting pboyI I am 100% sure stimulating adventurous life plays a role in balancing our hormones.. What do you suggest we do to make our lives meaningful? I don't like to focus too much on food and ignore everything else even though food is a very important aspect of health. Thanks for brining this up, pboy :)
I searched on the forum about our topic of discussion and I found this viewtopic.php?t=4702
Good stuff!

 

[narouz]

pboy is kinda the master of the neglected notion of
Action as a Nutrient,
as I like to think of it.

Peat does talk about it some, of course,
but...not a whole lot.

pboy...so I've noted action as a nutrient.
What about Thoughts?
Do you believe the thoughts one has influence nutrition/health...?

 

[narouz]

I noticed this thread by Such.
Maybe kinda related...

http://www.raypeatforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=7252
The Physiology of Willpower: Linking Blood Glucose to Self-Control

 

[pboy]

well I think that's subjective! indeed food, everything is important...for me, I guess, a long time ago I realized I just gotta go all into things, sometimes take 'risks' but when my heart is into it I don't feel like its a risk. Just have an explorative funny overall way of being, and be brave I guess...a lot has to do with just opening to and realizing possibilities and rest falls into its moment to moment place. Exploring the creation of life is quite possibly the most rewarding and enjoyable thing there is to me, in all its facets...but its subjective for sure and very relevant to just your personal history and exact place, time , situation and all that... as long as youre in the positive momentum though that's kinda all that matters, so anyone anywhere anytime can just tap into that. Good diet as the foundation helps, as soon as u get hungry or if you have GI issues it greatly hurts your desire and ability to feel joy and explorative, for me at least...I guess eating enough is important (well, enough energy...cuz a bad diet you could eat a lot and still not have much energy)

theres probably other factors at play too with the GH/prolactin thing, I'm not well versed in that area

as for what to do to make your life meaningful...ask yourself what it would take! only you really know that, each individual...but ultimately it has to do with diving in, not being afraid, courage of heart, if fear or doubt control you, you're effed

 

[Nicholas]

https://raypeatforum.com/forums/posts/96547/ Nicholas, thanks for taking your time to write and insight us with the true meaning of health.. You are such a savior to all of us, stupid people.

i don't write this assuming anyone is stupid reading it. being indoctrinated with lies is different than being stupid. i'm sure there are some things that you understand very well in life that others don't....does it mean they are stupid? my only desire is to expose those who contradict. and Peat is very good at this. i was trying to help you and answer your question. (you are the one who asked me) is my answer not welcome because you disagree with it?

 

[milk_lover]

No really, your answer is definitely welcomed.. and it's ok if we disagree, even though I didn't particularly disagree with your answer. We learn from each other. Keeping an open mind is very important to stimulate the mind which might have a positive impact on our hormones as pboy suggested :) It's just the way you wrote it did not give me a good vibe, probably because English is not my first language? I am more than ok if you tell me I could be on a wrong path regarding health.. Your point about health as a collective entity rather than individual pieces sounds reasonable btw.

pboy, Nice words.. "diving in, not being afraid, courage of heart" :)

 

[Nicholas]

https://raypeatforum.com/forums/posts/96568/ No really, your answer is definitely welcomed.. and it's ok if we disagree, even though I didn't particularly disagree with your answer. We learn from each other. Keeping an open mind is very important to stimulate the mind which might have a positive impact on our hormones as pboy suggested :) It's just the way you wrote it did not give me a good vibe, probably because English is not my first language? I am more than ok if you tell me I could be on a wrong path regarding health.. Your point about health as a collective entity rather than individual pieces sounds reasonable btw.

pboy, Nice words.. "diving in, not being afraid, courage of heart" :)

ok well, to be honest your vibe here is different than the sarcasm of your previous response. but i understand what you mean. i'm not sure that it's an English issue...it's that everyone has different styles and personalities. pboy's style is different than mine. i can't speak for pboy, but i think we have similar views..it's just that he presents them in an entirely different way - comes at it from a different angle. i sensed that you were open to what i had to share because you said you weren't interested in supplements but food. thus, i responded. my tone may come off as a little strong but that's because i'm trying to be firm and clear. that comes from my context and history of being controlled by lies surrounding the body and health. call me a fool, but i think it's something to be vigilant against because if people begin to see the truth then it saves so many years of confusion. i also say this understanding that we have to go through confusion to come out of it. at the end of the day it requires *multiple* people to answer a question that we have. assuming all the answers are on the same page (which they aren't here) then the different styles/perspectives by which the answer is given is most helpful to the person asking because it broadens the possibility for the person asking to identify.

 

[Brian]

In my experience, calcium intake did not change prolactin on my lab test. My first labs show high blood calcium, low PTH, low vit D, (and im outside everyday and tan) but high prolactin. Soon after the test, I drank up to a gallon of milk a day for a month and got re-tested. Prolactin near the same, blood calcium even higher and PTH and vit D even lower. My PTH was almost nil. It appears the higher the calcium intake the lower the PTH as most already know. But Im not sure if the high prolactin causes the high blood calcium or just a deficiency in something else that allows calcium to be out of control such as mag or vit k and then prolactin comes into play.

I recently had a discussion with Brain where he pointed out high prolactin seems to be an energy deficiency in the brain so anything that increase ATP should essentially lower prolactin. Im finding this to be true as magnesium has been extremely helpful with the calcium issue (no more heart palpitations, less anxiety, more energy and less of the head prolactin feel). So for this time around I've bumped up the mag, lowered the calcium and will get blood test soon and report on the prolactin.

My guess would be maybe try get adequate mag with your calcium (or high mag containing food) and see if you notice a difference.

The study I was referring to was this one posted by Haidut: viewtopic.php?f=75&t=5377&p=63381&hilit=prolactin+brain#p63381

Hypoglycemia in the brain is probably the biggest factor that causes stress hormone release, including prolactin. Calcium and Zinc play a role, but if the brain isn't getting enough steady fuel than increasing calcium or zinc isn't going to make a difference, especially if not enough magnesium and K2 are present to help calcium and zinc get into the right places and help get the wrong minerals out of where they shouldn't be (copper or cadmium where zinc should be for example)

So my reasoning is that things that help with energy production from different angles (ATP, Cytochrome c, insulin sensitivity, etc) should also help reduce stress hormones including prolactin. For me it's been simple things like eating easily digestible meals throughout the day, getting intense red light daily (especially on the head) and being in a well lit room if I'm inside. Getting lots of supplemental magnesium and some supplemental K2 has been very helpful for me too, probably because I became very deficient during my low-carb undereating years, when stress hormones were very high and my progesterone levels dropped (progesterone is involved in magnesium retention and utilization).

Also I've found that a little strength training to help a lot. The mechanism is probably increased mitochondria function and improved insulin sensitivity which should both help with energy reaching the brain in a more stable way.

 

[milk_lover]

https://raypeatforum.com/forums/posts/96594/

In my experience, calcium intake did not change prolactin on my lab test. My first labs show high blood calcium, low PTH, low vit D, (and im outside everyday and tan) but high prolactin. Soon after the test, I drank up to a gallon of milk a day for a month and got re-tested. Prolactin near the same, blood calcium even higher and PTH and vit D even lower. My PTH was almost nil. It appears the higher the calcium intake the lower the PTH as most already know. But Im not sure if the high prolactin causes the high blood calcium or just a deficiency in something else that allows calcium to be out of control such as mag or vit k and then prolactin comes into play.

I recently had a discussion with Brain where he pointed out high prolactin seems to be an energy deficiency in the brain so anything that increase ATP should essentially lower prolactin. Im finding this to be true as magnesium has been extremely helpful with the calcium issue (no more heart palpitations, less anxiety, more energy and less of the head prolactin feel). So for this time around I've bumped up the mag, lowered the calcium and will get blood test soon and report on the prolactin.

My guess would be maybe try get adequate mag with your calcium (or high mag containing food) and see if you notice a difference.

The study I was referring to was this one posted by Haidut: viewtopic.php?f=75&t=5377&p=63381&hilit=prolactin+brain#p63381

Hypoglycemia in the brain is probably the biggest factor that causes stress hormone release, including prolactin. Calcium and Zinc play a role, but if the brain isn't getting enough steady fuel than increasing calcium or zinc isn't going to make a difference, especially if not enough magnesium and K2 are present to help calcium and zinc get into the right places and help get the wrong minerals out of where they shouldn't be (copper or cadmium where zinc should be for example)

So my reasoning is that things that help with energy production from different angles (ATP, Cytochrome c, insulin sensitivity, etc) should also help reduce stress hormones including prolactin. For me it's been simple things like eating easily digestible meals throughout the day, getting intense red light daily (especially on the head) and being in a well lit room if I'm inside. Getting lots of supplemental magnesium and some supplemental K2 has been very helpful for me too, probably because I became very deficient during my low-carb undereating years, when stress hormones were very high and my progesterone levels dropped (progesterone is involved in magnesium retention and utilization).

Also I've found that a little strength training to help a lot. The mechanism is probably increased mitochondria function and improved insulin sensitivity which should both help with energy reaching the brain in a more stable way.

So what you're suggesting is stress physically and emotionally has an effect on prolactin levels in the body.. which makes me perfect sense because cortisol is probably the biggest brother of all other bad brothers like prolactin and they seem to come together and leave together.
I have two questions..

1) Are our bodies not able to use zinc effectively without magnesium?

2) The red light over head thing, is it practical to use in the work place without people giving you the weird look? How can you be normal in their eyes if I do things like that? It's not like I care about what they think of me much but I am so tired of people judging my white sugar consumption already on the daily basis.. It gets boring you know. And this might add more log to the fuel What kind of red light are you using? The name of the product if you don't mind :)

 

[milk_lover]

https://raypeatforum.com/forums/posts/96570/

https://raypeatforum.com/forums/posts/96568/ No really, your answer is definitely welcomed.. and it's ok if we disagree, even though I didn't particularly disagree with your answer. We learn from each other. Keeping an open mind is very important to stimulate the mind which might have a positive impact on our hormones as pboy suggested :) It's just the way you wrote it did not give me a good vibe, probably because English is not my first language? I am more than ok if you tell me I could be on a wrong path regarding health.. Your point about health as a collective entity rather than individual pieces sounds reasonable btw.

pboy, Nice words.. "diving in, not being afraid, courage of heart" :)

ok well, to be honest your vibe here is different than the sarcasm of your previous response. but i understand what you mean. i'm not sure that it's an English issue...it's that everyone has different styles and personalities. pboy's style is different than mine. i can't speak for pboy, but i think we have similar views..it's just that he presents them in an entirely different way - comes at it from a different angle. i sensed that you were open to what i had to share because you said you weren't interested in supplements but food. thus, i responded. my tone may come off as a little strong but that's because i'm trying to be firm and clear. that comes from my context and history of being controlled by lies surrounding the body and health. call me a fool, but i think it's something to be vigilant against because if people begin to see the truth then it saves so many years of confusion. i also say this understanding that we have to go through confusion to come out of it. at the end of the day it requires *multiple* people to answer a question that we have. assuming all the answers are on the same page (which they aren't here) then the different styles/perspectives by which the answer is given is most helpful to the person asking because it broadens the possibility for the person asking to identify.

Nicolas, I understand your point. And I kinda agree it's good to be firm and clear.. But isn't that to some degree authoritarian? It reminds me of the doctors that are old and fat wearing white jackets telling you to eat a lot of brown rice and whole wheat and eat a lot of fatty fish and nuts and fiber to become "healthy." They sounded so firm and clear to me until I realized they are bunch of arrogant ignorant people. Being firm and clear does not always translate to being right.

 

[Suikerbuik]

"Substances such as PTH, nitric oxide, serotonin, cortisol, aldosterone, estrogen, thyroid stimulating hormone, and prolactin have regulatory and adaptive functions that are essential, but that ideally should act only intermittently, producing changes that are needed momentarily. When the environment is too stressful, or when nutrition isn't adequate, the organism may be unable to mobilize the opposing and complementary substances to stop their actions. In those situations, it can be therapeutic to use some of the nutrients as supplements. Calcium carbonate (eggshell or oyster shell, for example) and vitamins D and K, can sometimes produce quick antistress effects, alleviating insomnia, hypertension, edema, inflammations and allergies, etc., but the regular use of milk and cheese can prevent many chronic stress-related diseases."
http://raypeat.com/articles/articles/milk.shtml

 

[Brian]

1) Are our bodies not able to use zinc effectively without magnesium?

I'm not exactly sure what their interaction is, but I do know that adequate magnesium helps keep many minerals in the right place, not just calcium. Copper/Cadmium in the testicles in places where zinc should be for example would disrupt the use of zinc. Zinc can't do it's job if other minerals are in the way. I got this idea from Dr. Garrett Smith on a few episodes of Matt Stone's podcast:

http://180radio.com/180degreehealth-26- ... cts-myths/
http://180radio.com/180degreehealth-13- ... ett-smith/

In his practice he's found that in general adequate Magnesium, B6, K2 help a lot with heavy metal removal, and moving calcium out of soft tissue. I don't think you necessarily need to decrease calcium intake, but my experience agrees with Smith's ideas that more calcium won't help much unless magnesium is being absorbed and retained properly. So I would also add that somehow raising your progesterone can also be very helpful for retaining the magnesium.

2) The red light over head thing, is it practical to use in the work place without people giving you the weird look? How can you be normal in their eyes if I do things like that? It's not like I care about what they think of me much but I am so tired of people judging my white sugar consumption already on the daily basis.. It gets boring you know. And this might add more log to the fuel What kind of red light are you using? The name of the product if you don't mind :)

I wouldn't worry about it all day at work, maybe just a bright soft white LED light or incandescent shining in your workspace just to increase the ambient lumens.

If you can't get an hour of near full body sunlight on your skin almost daily then I think it's worth considering finding some way working some extra light therapy into your life.

I've been using halogen work lights lately, but I'm not sure I would recommend them for everybody as they are probably a little overkill for most. I'm using it specifically for treating a patch of vitiligo on my upper lip, because the lumens are very high.

I think the standard 250w Brooder lamp that Peat suggests is probably the best solution for most people. If you aren't getting much sunlight I would consider buying a couple and making a little space at home where you can hit big parts of your naked body as close as comfortable at once for about 20 minutes or so per day.

I think getting red light through your skull can help decrease inflammation and increase ATP in your brain. An 850 nm LED array directly on the forehead can do this very well in just a few minutes and you only need to do it a couple times per week. I got this idea from a post by Joseph Cohen: http://selfhacked.com/2013/11/14/my-review-of-lllt/

 

[narouz]

https://raypeatforum.com/forums/posts/96785/

1) Are our bodies not able to use zinc effectively without magnesium?

I'm not exactly sure what their interaction is, but I do know that adequate magnesium helps keep many minerals in the right place, not just calcium. Copper/Cadmium in the testicles in places where zinc should be for example would disrupt the use of zinc. Zinc can't do it's job if other minerals are in the way. I got this idea from Dr. Garrett Smith on a few episodes of Matt's Stone's podcast:

http://180radio.com/180degreehealth-26- ... cts-myths/
http://180radio.com/180degreehealth-13- ... ett-smith/

In his practice he's found that in general adequate Magnesium, B6, K2 help a lot with heavy metal removal, and moving calcium out of soft tissue. I don't think you necessarily need to decrease calcium intake.

2) The red light over head thing, is it practical to use in the work place without people giving you the weird look? How can you be normal in their eyes if I do things like that? It's not like I care about what they think of me much but I am so tired of people judging my white sugar consumption already on the daily basis.. It gets boring you know. And this might add more log to the fuel What kind of red light are you using? The name of the product if you don't mind :)

I wouldn't worry about it all day at work, maybe just a bright soft white LED light or incandescent shining in your workspace just to increase the ambient lumens getting into your eye.

If you can't get an hour of near full body sunlight on your skin almost daily then I think it's worth considering finding some way working some extra light therapy into your life.

I've been using halogen work lights lately, but I'm not sure I would recommend them for everybody as they are probably a little overkill for most. I'm using it specifically for treating a patch of vitiligo on my upper lip, because lumens are very high.

I think the standard 250w Brooder lamp that Peat suggests is probably the best solution for most people. If you aren't getting much sunlight I would consider buying a couple and making a little space at home where you can hit big parts of your naked body at once for about 20 minutes or so.

I think getting red light through your skull can help decrease inflammation and increase ATP in your brain. An 850 nm LED array directly on the forehead can do this very well in just a few minutes and you only need to do it a couple times per week. I got this idea from a post by Joseph Cohen: http://selfhacked.com/2013/11/14/my-review-of-lllt/

Lots of interesting stuff in there. Thanks!

 

[Nicholas]

https://raypeatforum.com/forums/posts/96703/ Being firm and clear does not always translate to being right.

of course not.
like i said, i'm being firm and clear because i fell for so many lies over on peatarian and even pre-peatarian.
i asked my first week there (somewhat presciently of revelations to come) if maybe blood sugar regulation is what it all boils down to - but it was dismissed and still is today. for some reason, it's weirdly controvercial despite being so harmonious with what Peat has revealed. i see all the nonsense and confusion that i was sucked into and i desire to help (sometimes imperfectly).
there is good authority and there is bad authority.
a lot of people here would see Ray Peat as a credible authority
i will take your implication of my firmness and clarity as arrogance to heart.