Low Toxin Lifestyle Mike Roberto's simple explanation of "Toxic Bile Theory" & "vitamin A" toxicity

[charlie]

Hey Gabor, @gerdosi
- so OP (@thepowerofozone
) may be on a different hypothesis, but a lot of us are subscribers to a new paradigm of health and disease called Toxic Bile Theory.

Here's my breakdown:

This theory's name was coined by @NutriDetect
, but the idea was originally pioneered by a researcher named Anthony Mawson who has several papers connecting it to modern diseases, from flu to glioma to gulf war syndrome to rubella to the disease state known as "COVID".

In general, toxic bile theory states that when the liver becomes cholestatic, the bile ducts become damaged and the bile begins to "spill over" into the blood stream. This liver damage is often (but not always) caused by excess retinol stores, but can also be from copper toxicity, vaccine damage, and probably a ton of other things I'd argue like excess fructose and/or seed oil metabolites (toxic aldehydes).

Here are a few Mawson papers, but he's got a ton more:
https://ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8392079/ (Corona)
https://ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7712358/ (Vax damage)
https://ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6801530/ (Rubella)
https://ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6339135/ (Gulf War Illness)
Role of Fat-Soluble Vitamins A and D in the Pathogenesis of Influenza: A New Perspective (Flu)

Certain events can put this into overdrive, causing nasty disease bouts.

The key feature, however, is that the bile that enters the bloodstream is not just containing retinol -- it contains unbound retinyl esters and retinoic acids. Retinol, bound by RBP-4 (Retinol Binding Protein 4), is relatively harmless. But retinyl esters are anything but -- they're quite damaging, and this has been known for 50 years:

https://nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJM197604082941503

Interestingly, those retinyl esters are bound to... low density lipoproteins -- yes, LDL! This is something nobody in the cholesterol community talks about, but is a big reason why high LDL can be connected to disease states

This can take you down the vitamin A rabbit hole, which is easily summarized as such:

1. Fat soluble class of molecules
2. Accumulate in the liver
3. Toxic in excess
4. Difficult to metabolize and excrete
5. The acid metabolites are far more toxic than the retinol itself

While retinol itself is harmless when bound to RBP-4, the issue occurs when that system breaks, either due to:

1. Overloaded liver that breaks down
2. Low protein, zinc, and possibly taurine

You'd think that measuring serum retinol would be a great biomarker, but when the liver becomes damaged by either of the above two situations, it actually can't generate RBP-4, and the retinol gets stuck in the liver and isn't in serum.

As an example, researchers can often FIX "vitamin A deficiency" merely by providing protein and calories without any added vitamin A:

https://sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0002916523333677

So you can be in de-facto Hypervitaminosis A and have LOW serum retinol levels! But you'll get the nasty spillover of retinyl esters and retinoic acids. You can connect this situation with the majority of modern diseases, especially all of the skin conditions, diabetes, insulin resistance, and all the crap you see on American TV ads.

What Tucker linked to when I got sick this winter (an "overdrive" situation), it literally felt like I had every symptom of hypervitaminosis A. But that's crazy -- I was on a low vitamin A diet for over a year, how is that possible? Well, after 12 months of the diet, I *still* had absurdly high serum retinol numbers. What we're realizing is that we've got YEARS of this crap built into our livers. And sometimes, the liver seems to let it rip.

Maybe vitamin A is essential, some in this community argue it's not... but too many of us in the west have definitely met our quota through formula, milk/cereal fortification, medications, toxicity passed down from mom, and poor dietary decisions. As I undo that, I feel better and better each month.

So anyway, if this theory is in fact true (and I think it's the closest thing to the truth that we've got), the better lab test to determine subclinical and clinical vitamin A toxicity is to look at the ratio of serum retinyl esters to serum retinol. If it's over 5%, you're in trouble.

https://ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6692705/

But, guess what -- such a test isn't commercially available. Isn't that crazy?!

This whole thing can simultaneously fix a crapload of disease and blow open the LDL debate. It's wild.

Until then, I'm treating it like a marathon, not a sprint. I'll let you know when I become "vitamin A deficient" and if I go blind. My bet is that I do not, because I'm eating tons of protein and zinc. Also, don't believe the USDA, there's plenty of retinol in beef. So I'm not even on that low of a vitamin A diet. I'm normal, everyone else is just getting absurd amounts.

That's my take -- toxic bile theory is the missing glue for many of these "diet war" folks, and more will fold it into their hypotheses over time. Happy to send more research or answer questions.

View: https://x.com/MicroBerto/status/1782247333155004549

 

[DanDare]

It's a great summary.

TLDR :
On the question of what causes the accumulation, in addition to factors mentioned I am suspecting refined grains, sugar, and even substances which increase vitamin demand such as thyroid, along with stress/ activity in general, as exacerbating deficiency, and hence hindering detox and so promoting accumulation ( of a and other toxins) if eaten without balanced supplements.

Long:

The question most on my mind at the moment is about other dietary factors that allow us to get into this state in the first place besides consuming too much vitamin a, since we have:

Net accumulation= intake - excretion.

Several of a variety of factors have been mentioned including vax damage, seed oils, and excess fructose ( and a tonne more).

I am considering the flip side, about what is lacking in our diets. And specifically fibre and b vitamins.

People speak a lot about niacin, and fibre, rightly so I believe, however thiamine has plenty testimonials for really improving people's health yet is rarely spoken about , as do other b vitamins.

Incidentally this fits Peat's ideas because the B vitamins are normally connected to the production of energy, and hence function and structure.

Hence I wonder if refined grains / sugar should be added to the list of causes. After all several studies have shown refined grains to cause poor health that is corrected with whole grains.



Anecdotally my move from white rice to brown has been positive in quite a short time.

 

[Peater]

Also, don't believe the USDA, there's plenty of retinol in beef

I'm assuming/hoping he means beef fat rather than muscle tissue.

 

[charlie]

Very good summary of TOXIC BILE THEORY which toxic Vitamin A (not a vitamin) plays a key role.
Toxic Bile is a factor in many, if not all, of the autoimmune illnesses of today, as well as many of what is thought of as "infectious" diseases. In this thread is linked papers from Anthony Mawson, a well known and well respected researcher. He has papers linking retinoids to Covid, rubella, and flu, as well as making damage from vaccines worse. Is this why not all autism is in vaxxed kids? Maybe toxic retinoids and toxic bile play a role, even w/o vaccines. In these papers, Mawson may reference the associated "virus". But I say, no virus is needed and virology is another wrong assumption. Yes, I'm saying "viruses" do not exist. The toxic vit A metabolites can accumulate on their own, causing the symptoms associated with a particular "virus". Fever is associated with the body getting rid of vitamin A. The body is trying to excrete this toxin called Vit A. Follow this link for more on that.

View: https://x.com/thepowerofozone/status/1781831163637559672

Kids going through measles have less Vit A in their system. Mawson links rubella to Vit A toxicity. If the normal detox pathways are broken, the body turns to the skin to excrete toxins. There are many different skin disorders blamed on viruses, but what if many of these diseases are just broken detox pathways of the liver and gallbladder, thereby initiating the body to use the skin to detox. What is called illness is just the body trying to return to a healthy state, homeostasis. Illness is not caused by viruses.
Toxic Bile theory, with Vit A toxicity, needs to be studied further as the cause many of our symptoms that we call sickness.

View: https://x.com/ValZimmer2/status/1782382028060598727

 

[TripleOG]

Mike Roberto is the best low-A advocate, IMO.

Isn’t inflammatory. Doesn’t shock post all day for engagement. Willing to have open discussion. Doesn’t get pissy at pushback. Can explain the theory in laymen, but has the knowledge to get into the weeds if necessary. Just feels like he has the most “normal” disposition out of the gang if influencers we currently have. Doesn’t seem to be financially anchored to all this, either.

There’d probably be a lot less animosity if he was people’s introduction to VA toxicity / toxic bile theory.

 

[Blossom]

@TripleOG, yes.

 

[Peater]

View: https://x.com/ValZimmer2/status/1782382028060598727

Big question here then is does the measles "vaccine", by inducing an immune response to fragments of genetic code associated with VA 'balancing', cause VA overload or other issues? With VA being immune related, as well as to everything else it seems.

 

[charlie]

Mike Roberto is the best low-A advocate, IMO.

Isn’t inflammatory. Doesn’t shock post all day for engagement. Willing to have open discussion. Doesn’t get pissy at pushback. Can explain the theory in laymen, but has the knowledge to get into the weeds if necessary. Just feels like he has the most “normal” disposition out of the gang if influencers we currently have. Doesn’t seem to be financially anchored to all this, either.

There’d probably be a lot less animosity if he was people’s introduction to VA toxicity / toxic bile theory.