Sunmountain's Log

[sunmountain]

Blossom, I am very thankful that you have shared your experience. I am a bit surprised that you still experience gastroparesis and slowed motility sometimes -- somehow I thought you had recovered completely -- but what you describe also makes sense. As a matter of fact, the past couple of days I noticed a bit more hair falling, and realized that it coincided with slight under eating, as you say. Maybe for me, hair shedding is the signal at this time.

My lunch menu is still under construction, and that is where the slight under eating may have happened. Again, it's the restrictive thinking -- not too much starch, avoid pufa, etc. I'm aware of it, and trying not to get caught up in it. It may also have been poor meal planning. And, I'm wanting to eat nontraditional foods for lunch, so it's a question of finding what stimulates my taste buds, which seem to have changed.

Thanks for reminding me that all of this will take time. When I started feeling better a few weeks ago, I realized just that but it's easy to forget it. Your experience is also helpful in another way -- I know now that minor relapses are not uncommon.

I have dropped some of the Ayurvedic meds, but am continuing with a single dose of Triphala, and the Livercare. My bowel movements remain unchanged.

I don't know if I will do smartpill now. I have a requested instead a colonoscopy.

I went for a long, hilly walk a couple of times. My knees did fine, as did the muscles. I went slowly on the down incline, just to be safe.

It would be great if any other ED'ers out there also posted about their recovery and relapses. I imagine it would be helpful for all of us.

 

[Blossom]

I'm glad it helps to hear someone else's perspective. I don't think of myself as having had a relapse but I know I still have a tendency is to under eat. I guess after so many years it takes a while to change ingrained patterns. Mostly it's occasional but significant work stress or family stress that will throw me off for a meal or two here and there but nothing extreme. My body rebels hard when that happens with a return of acid reflux and stomach bloating but for the most part everything runs pretty smooth (pun intended) as long as I eat enough. My weight has been stable since the summer, the edema is finally gone and my muscles are returning with a vengeance. I literally have muscles I never knew existed! It's been a bumpy road at times but so, so worth it. I've been reading your journal and we have had a lot of the same symptoms but I guess it's been harder to talk openly about mine. I felt a lot of shame for some reason because of the stigma around anorexia. I don't think of myself as the 'typical' anorexic because mine wasn't really about body image and I never got below bmi 17 but I know now that even that was a dangerous level for me. Now that I'm starting to feel like I've finally beat this it seems easier to talk about. Well I don't mean to ramble on in your journal and I know we are all a bit different but I do want to encourage you to keep going! You're doing great and I think with time all of the aches, pains, moodiness and GI stuff will resolve completely for both of us. I'm so grateful to have knowledge from Peat through all of this because I think it's helped me avoid even worse symptoms or getting type 2 diabetes or something. I think I've come through relatively unscathed for someone in their mid forties! Thanks for reading my never ending paragraph!
P.S.
If you get a colonoscopy ask them to use a camera only and no radiation.

 

[moss]

The main issue remaining now is constipation and associated back pain and stomach bloat. Yesterday the thought occurred to me that I might have developed lazy bowel. I was on cascara nearly 1.5 years before it stopped working for me, or not as effectively. This December I switched to Triphala, a very old Ayurvedic formula, which is helping but still not complete evac.

The problem is that I no longer feel contractions in my bowel that used to tell me that I need to go. It feels very strange. I might just sit on the toilet to pee and realize that if I push slightly, some poop might come out. I do feel some pressure when I go in the mornings daily, but not pressure in the old way. All this has been going on for some time.

So I'm wondering if I should simply stop everything and see how bad it gets. Or try prune juice. Or take something bulking like slippery elm. I eat about a cup of veggies daily, so there's fiber. I try to walk daily even if it's just on the treadmill. I'm also wondering if the moderate amount of farmer cheese that I eat daily along with veggies, plus other lunch cheese might be contributing to constipation.

Hello again SM,
Thought I would chime in with a couple of things that may or may not be of help.

Your thoughts that you may have developed a lazy bowel because you were on Cascara for around 1.5 years may be the case. I see Cascara more as a 'symptomatic reliever' and obviously it does help empty the bowels, however, long term use can lead to independence and may be the reason why you can no longer feel contractions as you once did (assuming you have ruled out other possibilities such as bowel obstruction, meds, severe dis-stress).

Hopefully, having a rest from stimulant laxatives and trying a bulk laxative such as Slippery Elm and/or Marshmallow powders are both very helpful medicinal foods not only for digestive conditions but where there is inflamed mucous membrane linings and they will help support and normalise eliminations and learning to re-train your bowels is important.
Lower back pain and stomach bloat can be classic symptoms arising from constipation as I am sure you are aware of.
Meditation and breathing practices also go a long way in relaxing the bowels. This is speaking from experience, does help re-route the energy from the front door to the back door, so to speak!

I also agree with Jennifer pears are excellent for moving things along.....

And I know you mentioned you want to eat non-traditional foods (for lunch) and if you can be bothered this is an easy recipe - comforting and warming. I make this in winter and have baked custard with it, delicious and satisfying anytime of the day.

Cut up around 4-5 pears and/or apples into smallish chunks

• A generous chunk of ginger, (if you like it) finely sliced into match sticks or grated.

• 1 x Cinnamon stick (Cinnamon zeylanicum, not cassia) a little harder to find if you have an Indian food supply store nearby they generally sell them and cheaper than high end deli stores or ground cinnamon will also do.

• 1-2 tablespoons of sugar (depending of your taste and if you don't wish to use sugar you can add honey, can be added at the end after the fruit has cooked and still warm).

• About a cup of water add to this 1 x Cinnamon stick or the powder, sugar and ginger and bring to boil and simmer for around 5 minutes, then add apples and pears simmer with lid on until till soft.

It is thought Rhubarb root may have a slight advantage over other more powerful laxatives reducing the possibility of weakening the colon from laxative overuse, however, it is best used in conjunction with other herbs to attenuate its high tannin content.
I found this preparation on line just now. I have not used it nor know anything about the company, it looks to be reputable and in North America and may be worth having a look at.
It is from a very old formulation that comes from one of the popular eclectic remedies by John Uri Lloyd
http://classicalformulas.com/Shop/Product/NeutralizingCordial.html
Chamomile, Peppermint stimulate peristalsis due to their high volatile oils and are calming.

Fingers cross you get some relief asap.

I'm glad it helps to hear someone else's perspective. I don't think of myself as having had a relapse but I know I still have a tendency is to under eat. I guess after so many years it takes a while to change ingrained patterns. Mostly it's occasional but significant work stress or family stress that will throw me off for a meal or two here and there but nothing extreme. My body rebels hard when that happens with a return of acid reflux and stomach bloating but for the most part everything runs pretty smooth (pun intended) as long as I eat enough. My weight has been stable since the summer, the edema is finally gone and my muscles are returning with a vengeance. I literally have muscles I never knew existed! It's been a bumpy road at times but so, so worth it. I've been reading your journal and we have had a lot of the same symptoms but I guess it's been harder to talk openly about mine. I felt a lot of shame for some reason because of the stigma around anorexia. I don't think of myself as the 'typical' anorexic because mine wasn't really about body image and I never got below bmi 17 but I know now that even that was a dangerous level for me. Now that I'm starting to feel like I've finally beat this it seems easier to talk about. Well I don't mean to ramble on in your journal and I know we are all a bit different but I do want to encourage you to keep going! You're doing great and I think with time all of the aches, pains, moodiness and GI stuff will resolve completely for both of us. I'm so grateful to have knowledge from Peat through all of this because I think it's helped me avoid even worse symptoms or getting type 2 diabetes or something. I think I've come through relatively unscathed for someone in their mid forties! Thanks for reading my never ending paragraph!
P.S.
If you get a colonoscopy ask them to use a camera only and no radiation.

Great stuff!

 

[sunmountain]

I'm so grateful to have knowledge from Peat through all of this because I think it's helped me avoid even worse symptoms or getting type 2 diabetes or something

Dr. Peat's writings helped me to:
- keep eating sugar (though I cut back from the bags of fructose), so that I can avoid diabetes. My blood sugar has gotten better (no more dizzy spells, for example), though not out of the woods yet (get low sugar feeling when too much time between meals, i.e., low glycogen)
- make the connection between edema and estrogen, so that now progest-e is the best diuretic for me out there. I know now the dose I need these days to keep the water out.
- understand the dangers of pufa, and its connection to diabetes, among other things.
- adopt healthy foods like sugar, coffee, Apple or orange juice (now it's Apple due to sensitive teeth), farmer cheese, other cheese, honey, etc.

The forum helped me to:
- understand the importance of eating more to begin healing from ED, and pointed me to Youreatopia where I learned what to expect in recovery (thanks Tara, Blossom, Jennifer, and others). I'm thinking that perhaps every ED'er has to cross a quantitative eating threshold before recovery can begin, and this threshold is different for everyone. I did not hit my threshold until I went overseas in December. And I needed the traditional foods to stimulate the gastric juices to make me WANT to eat more.
- understand the role of the liver in just about everything, and the importance of protein (thanks Haidut). That it's better to tackle the liver before starting peating (hindsight now, thanks Haidut).
- get tons of good food recipes and advice, some of which I ultimately retained, and some not.

Thanks for going on, Blossom. Yay, to your continued recovery! The most important and helpful things I've learned from your recent posts is that under eating happens even when one is relatively recovered, and the reminder that recovery takes a long time. So do continue to share your experience!

Hi Moss, Great to hear again from you! Thanks especially for the reminder about meditation. I never quite KNOW if it's actually doing anything, but believe in it, so am trying to pick it up again. Thanks for the apples/pears recipe. I had been doing something along the lines about a year ago, then dropped it due to following FODMAPS and other diets. I'm gladly picking it up again this weekend. The addition of ginger and cinnamon is new, and I'm really looking forward to it. I think it'll make a nice addition to my lunches. I also plan to get peppermint tea this weekend. The cordial looks very interesting. I may try it if things don't improve after a while. What do you think about prune juice?

Now the update. I've gained a couple of pounds to 131. No idea what that's about, and it makes no difference to my recovery. Maybe the liver still has a ways to go.

For mood, I'm adding back in pregnenolone. I haven't taken it since quite a while. This time, I'll do it transdermally and order some more of Haidut's.

I've been a little tired lately. Is it recovery, or mood, or the PT for my spine that I'm getting. The therapist is doing a fair amount of manipulation, and it's helping. I've also got some sudden pain in my left jaw, probably due to clenching my teeth during sleep. It's hard to open the jaw all the way since 3-4 days. I have an old mouth guard from 20 years ago that I started using last night. I wonder about the clenching. I've got some ongoing trauma issues going on with family of origin, that I'm trying to move past, but there are intrusive memories, etc. Maybe the Preg will help.

Continuing to poop 1-2 times/day. Only one triphala a day, and I don't think it's a stimulant. It tones the GI tract, per the literature, and also restores bowel regularity after a while. Also continuing Livercare.

 

[tara]

I literally have muscles I never knew existed!

Woohoo.! :)

I'm thinking that perhaps every ED'er has to cross a quantitative eating threshold before recovery can begin, and this threshold is different for everyone. I did not hit my threshold until I went overseas in December. And I needed the traditional foods to stimulate the gastric juices to make me WANT to eat more.

This makes sense to me. Glad you found some food you want to eat. :)

 

[sunmountain]

I've gotten TMJ for the first time...all last week. Can't open jaw fully without pain on left side.

Have an old mouth guard from two decades ago that I'm using at night.

Any peaty ways to deal with TMJ before I call my doc? Muscle relaxants?

 

[tara]

Any peaty ways to deal with TMJ before I call my doc? Muscle relaxants?

I've not experienced it (opposite problem), just a couple of speculations.
I wonder whether a bit of extra magnesium, maybe topically, would help?
Are you keeping up with your appetite?
Direct massage, osteopathy, accupressure or similar?
CO2 techniques?

 

[Giraffe]

Meditation and breathing practices also go a long way in relaxing the bowels.

+1 :)

Any peaty ways to deal with TMJ before I call my doc?

Tension is the jaw is often caused by issues in the neck (or cervical spine) and/or upper back. I looked up videos of simple techniques I find helpful:

• progressive muscle relaxation
  
• massage with a tennis ball.

Progressive muscle relaxation works different for different people. For me it was mainly a tool to raise self-awareness (and not get tense so easy when I am stressed).

Mittir recommended a meditation video here: easy and useful.

Muscle relaxants?

The only muscle relaxant I ever tried is said to be addictive, so it's advised to only take it for a very short period of time. I loved the stuff for the restful sleep it provided (that's what I took it for, I hadn't slept in days because of pains), but it didn't do much for solving the problem at its root.

 

[sunmountain]

TMJ is continuing, maybe worse, hard to open mouth far enough to chew, pain while chewing.

I want to try magnesium supplement, but which kind? Very confusing different kinds.

Giraffe, thanks for the links. I like the progressive which switches tension and relaxation. Though I'm not sure I should tense the jaw right now.

I'm wondering if all the spine manipulation by the PT might be related to the TMJ. I just assumed I was clenching teeth while sleeping. He has been working all along the spine from top to bottom.

I found a couple Youtubes related to TMJ exercises, but no relief so far.

 

[tara]

I want to try magnesium supplement, but which kind? Very confusing different kinds.

Here's my take on it, mainly from reading here.

Internally: Some people here rave about Mg bicarbonate, which you have to make up yourself with carbonated water and either milk of magnesia or Mg hydroxide - supposed to be very easy to absorb. Peat's top recommendation for Mg seems to be broth from green veges. He's also mentioned Mg carbonate as good. Possibly also Mg glycinate, though I think Dan Wich said there were issues with quality with some formulations containing quite a bit o Mg oxide, which may not be so great. I've used all these and can't tell which is better or worse. There is some in coffee, but you have to drink and awful lot to get near to meeting needs, and needs are likley higher if metabolism is down.

Topically: Mg sulphate (epsom salts) or Mg chloride. Mg sulphate quite a few people use in the bath tub. Both Mg sulphate and Mg chloride can be applide as more concentrated solutions directly on the skin - some find that works well, others find it irritates the skin. I've found Mg chloride a bit itchy/irritating. But it might work to put it on directly on your face where you have the tension.

As usual, it also comes down to what you can easily get your hands on, that doesn't have too much other junk in it (eg titanium dioxide etc), and some peopel seem to do better with some kinds than others.

 

[Giraffe]

I wouldn't tense the jaw either right now (when you find it hard to relax). What about your neck? Is it stiff? Have you tried epsom salt bath and red light? ... just brainstorming... :)

 

[moss]

What do you think about prune juice?

Prune juice is fine, eating prunes is the better way to go I find.

I wouldn't tense the jaw either right now (when you find it hard to relax). What about your neck? Is it stiff? Have you tried epsom salt bath and red light? ... just brainstorming... :)

Great suggestions and here's more brainstorming...

Foot massage!
This will release tension and helps regulate breathing, gets the energy from your head and back down to your feet.
I didn’t mentioned this on an earlier post because foot massage is not every ones thing and I’ve yet to hear Ray mention anything about!
If you like it and have someone who can massage your feet, say half an hour on each foot I do believe this will be so helpful for you, particularly at the moment with regards to the tension and pain you are experiencing in your jaw. In the absence of someone around to do this for you, sitting up somewhere comfortably on a sofa and bring one foot up and rest, either on a cushion or across your other knee - whichever way is most comfortable for you. Massage cream (doesn’t have to be anything fancy) into your foot and this will help stimulate reflex points in the foot, improve blood and lymphatic circulation, reduce inflammation and a great strategy for relaxation. Starting off with a Epsom salt foot bath (be generous and throw in a minimum of one to two cups of ES) will give you a decent dose of mg.
There is nothing fancy about this. I do this often in the evening and find it relaxing and helpful. It will take the focus off your jaw (hopefully it is tension/worry rather that something more profound) and I usually have a juice afterwards. This is simple stuff and worth a try.

 

[HDD]

I just came across this on the wiki page-
TMJD / Jaw cartilage
Have you watched your temperature and pulse rate with various foods? The high magnesium content of coffee, combined with milk and fruit, can help a little with hypothyroidism, but you might need a supplement, to normalize the jaw cartilage.

Peatarian.com Email Exchanges - Ray Peat Forum Wiki

 

[sunmountain]

I called the PT at 7am and saw him at 9am. He worked my neck a lot. Here's the weird part. The TMJ is on the left side. He found it hurt on the right side. Plus he found it hurt fierce UNDER the jawline on either side. It was BAD at those points. Plus along the neck various points. After working it a lot, he put me on "stim," first time, on neck. Nice! The current moving around took some getting used to, but I nearly fell asleep.

Then I went home and tried to eat lunch, and it was hard, but I ate anyway. Then I went to Target and got a microwaveable heating pad and naproxen and went to work. I ate two naproxen and worked with the heating pad. Now at supper time, the jaw hurt initially but after a while I didn't feel the pain anymore. I guess the naproxen did the job. The pain is not noticeable right now, but I doubt the problem is gone. Tomorrow will tell.

Tara, I knew about Mg bicarbonate but hesitated to make it, not wanting to alter the stomach pH, given everything I've gone through. I MAY be having some acid issue anyway, which would be a sign of low acid. I had also read Dan's investigation of Mg Glycinate. I do have mag oil and will apply it to jaw. I've applied it to legs before and it does sting a bit and I don't know how much is absorbed. I could try mag carbonate -- do all forms of magnesium lower stomach acid? -- or mag taurate which was mentioned on some post I think by Haidut?

Giraffe, I do red light at work most days. Haven't yet done Epsom bath this season, though I might do it tomorrow as I might be snowed in again. Or an Epsom foot bath.

MOss, if things don't get better tomorrow, I might see the massage therapist and focus on foot. That sounds heavenly anyhow. I keep forgetting to pick up prune juice, but will put it on the list now. I don't often see fresh prunes.

Thanks for the quote, HDD. I haven't been watching temp/pulse with food, though I'd like to. Mostly I'm warm these days. Total half cynoplus daily, divided.

One other thing. I've dropped my dosage of progest-e. I had ramped up the dose to a strip each morning and night. I noticed tiredness and muscle pain, and realized that was the only thing I had changed. So I dropped the dose, and seem to be doing alright again in the muscle department. For some reason, high dose progest-e may correlate with muscle pain for me. Maybe it needs even more protein than I'm presently taking great care to eat.

Speaking of protein, I can eat Greek yogurt again! And not just any, but Nancy's honey flavor which has 23g protein in a small cup! I used to be able to eat it until I started getting stiff. Now I've been eating it for at least a week, and no issues. It's an easy way for me to add a shot of protein. With that plus farmer cheese almost daily, I'm doing good with protein. For carbs, I eat sugar to taste and honey, and starch, and apple juice.

I might try diamox again for edema, which comes and goes, though not by much.

I started back on Preg. Too early to tell. I'm under a lot of mental and emotional stress these days. Trying to be more regular with meditation too.

 

[tara]

One other thing. I've dropped my dosage of progest-e. I had ramped up the dose to a strip each morning and night. I noticed tiredness and muscle pain, and realized that was the only thing I had changed. So I dropped the dose, and seem to be doing alright again in the muscle department. For some reason, high dose progest-e may correlate with muscle pain for me. Maybe it needs even more protein than I'm presently taking great care to eat.

I don't know if this is relevant, but I think high progesterone may waste sodium, which might affect Mg retention and water control. More progesterone may sometimes require more salt?

 

[sunmountain]

Thanks Tara, I do eat a good bit of salt, to taste. But perhaps I might still not retain enough Mg? I went ahead and ordered Swanson Mg Malate -- it seemed to have the least excipients, and I couldn't find anything saying it would affect stomach acid. I've also started to apply Mg oil again.

The Preg has kicked in. My mood is much better. I am much more hopeful. Thoughts are less intrusive. So much benefit from one small helping every night. Even though nothing external has changed, I feel less helpless and depressed. I can recall clearly how I felt a few days ago before Preg, and the difference is nothing short of amazing.

 

[tara]

The Preg has kicked in. My mood is much better. I am much more hopeful. Thoughts are less intrusive. So much benefit from one small helping every night. Even though nothing external has changed, I feel less helpless and depressed. I can recall clearly how I felt a few days ago before Preg, and the difference is nothing short of amazing.

:)

 

[sunmountain]

Things have been up and down the past few days. Mood was low over the weekend especially even with Preg. Yesterday mood was better. Took waking pulse and temp again yesterday: 97.2 and mid-to-high 80s pulse. Pulse has been high at least since December. I'm feeling tired again, though not achy like before. Brain fog too. Low back pain continuing, feeling better with PT off and on. Hunger also affected, though I'm continuing to eat about the same.

Is a high pulse due to adrenaline, if temps are the same?

Can edema cause adrenaline?

Can adrenaline be high even if cortisol is ok?

I did some sleuthing and discovered that the Ayurvedic formula that I took for about 4-6 weeks while overseas contained a herb that helps with fluid balance. I had stopped it a few weeks ago since I was feeling ok. It might be that the edema got worse subsequently. I will be getting more of the formula soon and will restart it then.

I do have the diamox, thanks to a kind forum member, but haven't started it yet.

I could not get magnesium malate, so got magnesium aspartate, which I'm taking two a day. I'm not sure it's doing anything, so thinking of switching to mag citrate which might also help constipation, or mag Glycinate (which contains oxide as well). I've been holding off mag bicarbonate in order not to lower stomach acid, but am wondering if taking it between meals might be ok, though like Garfield, my between times are short these days.

Also have been noticing some interesting eating patterns. Like when the portion on the plate finishes, I assume I'm done, I don't need to eat any more. But in fact I can eat more as I've found, so it's getting over that slight restriction, which is really not slight since it kept me underfed for so long (how long?). Who decided and why and when that I would be "done" after a small portion? Were these signals from around me? A few days ago I visited my aunt and sister who were amazed at the amount I was eating.

It's not a straightforward job to eat normally after ED even after giving myself permission to do so. Even though I'm eating a lot, it takes some thinking to open up my eating choices and realize that there are many things I can eat that I had stopped due to FODMAPS or other reasons. Maybe I'm still overthinking it because I'm trying to avoid pufa, get enough protein and sugar, etc. Anyway I cooked again a dish I used to make in the past: pasta with marinara, ricotta, veggies, mozzarella, and plan to add it to my menu. I also made traditional rice pudding for the first time (100% peaty) and really enjoyed it, though might not be able to tolerate the milk, though when I had it overseas the milk didn't cause issues.

 

[sunmountain]

I just received more of the Ayurvedic formula and have started back on it. While waiting for it to arrive, I tracked down the diuretic herb here and got it and started it, and the edema resolved. The low back pain that came back recently is still there, though less, and I think it will resolve too. But the single herb did cause a lot of tiredness maybe from potassium loss, which I did not feel while on the formula, so I am glad to be able to stop it and begin the formula again.

I also started on high dose magnesium aspartate, 2 caps x 2 daily so far. I feel it! My body is much more relaxed, and my mood better. It is helping the constipation too with softer BM's.

The issue now I'm thinking about is the fast pulse (in the 80s upon waking, which is unusual from past performance). It was fast even in S Asia in December. Lately some breathlessness after one flight stairs.

Blossom suggested I check out YE for hypermetabolism. I did, the symptoms seem to correspond: fast heartbeat, breathlessness, heat, tiredness. There's also been insomnia this week.

It's confusing because things keep shifting. I was doing well after India, then edema due to stopping formula, then hypermetabolism.

I have not really tracked my pulse at other times during the day than waking, and that only occasionally, but waking is consistently eighties. I checked yesterday evening at rest and it was 94. In S Asia in December, one evening, it was 98. I'll continue to check it a bit more often now especially during the day when my heart seems to beat faster.

Blossom also provided the medical range above which Doc's think it's a problem, and I haven't hit that yet based on above readings.

She also suggested it could be that I don't need as much thyroid, or even the heart muscle repairing itself. Today I got labs for thyroid.

In light of stressed kidneys, I lowered protein a little bit yesterday and today. Maybe it's that, and a lot of rest today, but I'm feeling better. My pulse right now is early eighties, better than yesterday.

The insomnia and morning tiredness made getting to work on time challenging this week.

Also challenging is how to eat a big lunch at work. The pasta dish helps there, plus snacks like yogurt etc. But making two meals a day every day is also challenging, so I've eaten out two days this week and didn't worry about it.

Also I think I need to just give up the idea that I'm going to be able to predict when I can go hiking again. I get my hopes up...then dashed. I just need to let it go for now.

 

[sunmountain]

Skipped thyroid yesterday and felt better, more normal heartbeat.

Took it this morning, and again fast heartbeat and uncomfortable.

The labs should be in soon...