Thoughts on FMT? (Fecal Microbiota Transplant)

[Hidden49]

Was just curious to know what the opinion was on FMT over here was and if anyone has tried it for themselves.

I see the gut microbiome as like our second DNA. So I feel like doing a FMT you could potentially pick up someone’s stored trauma. And also potentially pick up personality traits of the donor.

Plus the fact that you aren’t actually able to see any of the donors in real life (unless you do a DIY one) to see how they function, what their diet and lifestyle is like is also sketchy to me.

I had a look on the FMT Facebook group and seems to be a lot of reports of people saying it made them worse and gave them new issues. Yet I see it is also a great success for many.

I do think having strong bile flow, HCL production, low endotoxin is key to good gut health, but I do think our gut microbiome is pretty specific/individual to each of us and quite hard to remodel. So that will play a big role in what our personalities are like, what foods we crave, how successful we are etc.

 

[Rinse & rePeat]

I see the gut microbiome as like our second DNA. So I feel like doing a FMT you could potentially pick up someone’s stored trauma. And also potentially pick up personality traits of the donor.

,but I do think our gut microbiome is pretty specific/individual to each of us and quite hard to remodel. So that will play a big role in what our personalities are like, what foods we crave, how successful we are etc.

This is an interesting topic, and I agree with some of the idea, especially blood transfusions and organ donations, but I am not sure about waste matter. I would think swapping saliva, kissing someone, would be more likely to transfer DNA than waste matter.

 

[Dolomite]

#336
That is a link to @Rinse & rePeat 's thread about C. diff. It is recommended to use a relative's transplant material.

 

[Hidden49]

This is an interesting topic, and I agree with some of the idea, especially blood transfusions and organ donations, but I am not sure about waste matter. I would think swapping saliva, kissing someone, would be more likely to transfer DNA than waste matter.

You misunderstood me*, what I meant is our gut microbiome ACTS like our second DNA. Rather than speaking about it transferring DNA, that’s another story.

I think our microbiome is largely based on what we inheret from our mothers and what we are exposed to and experience through life.

 

[Iceman2016]

As has been touched up on, the issue with fecal transplants is that unless the donor is very carefully pre-selected, you don't know what you're getting. For example, I've read of reports where a FMT from an overweight donor to a skinny recipient has caused the recipient to become overweight, and vice versa. Just as there are positive effects from microbiome elements we don't fully understand yet, I'm assuming the same would apply to negative effects as well.

The one thing that FMT has shown to be invaluable in treating is a c. dificile infection that has otherwise been resistant to treatment.

 

[Kimster]

I know we're not mice, yet great mice studies using FMT. Also listened about a year ago to a Dr. David Perlmutter podcast. He used it with an autistic patient and the results were fabulous. Againm read all the time about using it with C.Diff. I always tell my Chiropractor that he could sell his poop cuz he's super healthy and has never been vaccinated.

 

[Ras]

This link has a lot of information on FMT: FMT - Everything to Know About Fecal Microbiota Transplants - Human Microbiome

 

[Rinse & rePeat]

You misunderstood me*, what I meant is our gut microbiome ACTS like our second DNA. Rather than speaking about it transferring DNA, that’s another story.

I think our microbiome is largely based on what we inheret from our mothers and what we are exposed to and experience through life.

Ray Peat says this too…

“Organisms are most sensitive to environmental damage early in life, especially prenatally. This is the period in which normal hormone exposure masculinizes the brain, for example. The term "imprinting" refers to the extreme responsiveness of the organism at this time, and it has been extended to include long lasting influences which may result from abnormally high or low levels of natural substances, or from the presence of other, abnormal substances during the sensitive period. The effects of early "imprinting" can cause permanently altered sensitivities. In animal studies, L. C. Strong showed that prenatal influences determine the age at which puberty and reproductive senescence occur. In humans, premature birth, a powerful stressor, is associated with premature puberty. The thymus is damaged both by premature birth and by puberty. The effects of damage early in life will increase vulnerability in subsequent decades.

When babies are imprinted by the mother's disturbed hormones, or by diuretics, by milk substitutes, or by industrial effluents, the worst effects are likely to be seen decades later, or even generations later. A similar long-range effect can be produced by nutritional deficiencies.” -Ray Peat


“When babies are imprinted by the mother's diuretics, by milk substitutes, and by industrial effluents, the worst effects are likely to be seen decades later, or even generations later." -Ray Peat


"Autistic children and their relatives have high concentrations of serotonin in their serum and platelets. Members of a family tend to eat the same foods and to share other environmental conditions. Prenatal hypothyroidism and various kinds of imprinting, including hyperestrogenism, could account for this.” -Ray Peat


“Not so many years ago, people believed that traits were “determined by genes,” and that the development of an organism was the result of--was caused by--the sequential expression of genes in the nucleus of the fertilized egg. When B.F. Skinner in the 1970s said “a gestating baby isn't influenced by what happens to its mother,” he was expressing a deeply rooted bio-medical dogma. Physicians insisted that a baby couldn't be harmed by its mother's malnutrition, as long as she lived to give birth. People could be quite vicious when their dogma was challenged, but their actions were systematically vicious when they weren't challenged.“ -Ray Peat


“We are "imprinted" by our mothers' hormonal and nutritional conditions, but we can intervene to correct these "inherited" conditions, by maintaining optimal hormonal and nutritional balances.” -Ray Peat


“An individual’s hormone balance can be disrupted by exposure to radiation, estrogens, or unsaturated fats. The hormonal balance of the parent is imprinted upon the offspring, acting on the chromosomes, the liver, brain, genitals, pituitary, bones--in fact, the prenatal imprint can probably be found everywhere in the offspring.” -Ray Peat


“Some studies have suggested that trace amounts of nutrients could be passed on for a few generations, but the evidence now indicates that these transgenerational effects are caused by phenomena such as “imprinting.” But the hereditary effects of nutrients are so complex that their recognition would force nutrition to be recognized as one of the most complex sciences, interwoven with the complexities of growth and development.” -Ray Peat


“Despite the research of people like the Shutes and the Biskinds, there were still "educated" and influential people who said that the mother's diet had no influence on the baby. (That strange attitude affects many aspects of behavior and opinion.)

How can people believe that the mother's diet has no effect on the baby's health? Textbooks used to talk about the "insulated" fetus, which would get sufficient nutrients from the mother's body even if she were starving. To "prove" the doctrine, it was pointed out that the fetus gets enough iron to make blood even when the mother is anemic. In the last few years, the recognition that smoking, drinking, and using other drugs can harm the baby has helped to break down the doctrine of "insulation," but there is still not a medical culture in which the effects of diet on the physiology of pregnancy are appreciated.” -Ray Peat


“There are many toxins which modify hormonal responses, activating cells and altering the immune system (including estrogens and dioxins.) When these act early in life, extremely small amounts can cause life-long changes.” -Ray Peat