Tooth Decay Help

[Andy316]

Does anyone know what this tooth decay is called? I had it as a kid and dentist did some filling when I was 8-9 yo. Its come back with a vengeance recently and I am not sure what to do. Antibiotics or visit to dentist again? My diet is pretty clean - No alcohol, no excess sugar or starch. Mostly 60% animal protein, 30% carbs (White rice), veggies and 10% fat.

 

[youngsinatra]

Damn, visit the dentist. That’s not looking good.

 

[Rinse & rePeat]

Does anyone know what this tooth decay is called? I had it as a kid and dentist did some filling when I was 8-9 yo. Its come back with a vengeance recently and I am not sure what to do. Antibiotics or visit to dentist again? My diet is pretty clean - No alcohol, no excess sugar or starch. Mostly 60% animal protein, 30% carbs (White rice), veggies and 10% fat.

Grains are the problem with tooth decay not sugar.

 

[Rinse & rePeat]

“In a nutshell (pardon the pun) – grains, seeds, nuts and legumes have high phytic acid content and act as anti-nutrients by lowering our blood phosphorous levels and blocking our body’s ability to absorb necessary minerals from our diet. These foods can ruin your teeth.”

Foods That Ruin Your Dental Health | Evolve Dental Healing

Dr Rachel Hall Kenmore dentist explains the foods that ruin your teeth and guess what they don't all contain sugar. Here are the foods that ruin your teeth

www.evolvedental.com.au

 

[cdg]

“In a nutshell (pardon the pun) – grains, seeds, nuts and legumes have high phytic acid content and act as anti-nutrients by lowering our blood phosphorous levels and blocking our body’s ability to absorb necessary minerals from our diet. These foods can ruin your teeth.”

Foods That Ruin Your Dental Health | Evolve Dental Healing

Dr Rachel Hall Kenmore dentist explains the foods that ruin your teeth and guess what they don't all contain sugar. Here are the foods that ruin your teeth

www.evolvedental.com.au

I thought calcium to phosphate should be high so reducing phosphate should be a good thing???

 

[Rinse & rePeat]

I thought calcium to phosphate should be high so reducing phosphate should be a good thing???

Ray Peat doesn’t recommend high phosphate. The high calcium is to minimize the negatives in phosphate.


“The foods highest in phosphate, relative to calcium, are cereals, legumes, meats, and fish. Many prepared foods contain added phosphate. Foods with a higher, safe ratio of calcium to phosphate are leaves, such as kale, turnip greens, and beet greens, and many fruits, milk, and cheese.” -Ray Peat

https://youtu.be/8g_LQy9xieM?si=8Spp8WZDYXzWXsvW

 

[cdg]

Does anyone know what this tooth decay is called? I had it as a kid and dentist did some filling when I was 8-9 yo. Its come back with a vengeance recently and I am not sure what to do. Antibiotics or visit to dentist again? My diet is pretty clean - No alcohol, no excess sugar or starch. Mostly 60% animal protein, 30% carbs (White rice), veggies and 10% fat.

Check this out many people have healed their teeth with microcurrents:
View: https://youtu.be/msceFdHittI

 

[RealNeat]

Does anyone know what this tooth decay is called? I had it as a kid and dentist did some filling when I was 8-9 yo. Its come back with a vengeance recently and I am not sure what to do. Antibiotics or visit to dentist again? My diet is pretty clean - No alcohol, no excess sugar or starch. Mostly 60% animal protein, 30% carbs (White rice), veggies and 10% fat.

Your tartar buildup is on a whole new level, they will have to ultrasonically remove that build up and you probably have major gum recession under that. Look into PrimalLife organic products and Calcium Therapy Institute.

Bushing with baking soda like this video shows and you should be able to work at some of it. But dont be surprised if you have loose teeth after that tartar comes off.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ktNhvkmB00



You either dont brush or you have some nutrient or dietary issues thats resulting in such crazy buildup.

Here is a video on how to brush your teeth, i would also start blotting.


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6mhRTDBNQ-M


and how to blot


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E0SmEhBp8qU



If you want to dodge xrays try to find a dentist that offers transillumination instead.

 

[Ben.]

Check this out many people have healed their teeth with microcurrents:
View: https://youtu.be/msceFdHittI

Interesting. I checked the homepage of that group, in regards to teeth/gums most posts end up being "go to the dentist". I havent ever realy came across a dentist that actually heals teeth and gums but w/e.

 

[InChristAlone]

Well that has to be taken off by the dentist, but to prevent it look in to Dr Ellie's mouthcare system if you don't ever want to visit the dentist.

 

[RealNeat]

Well that has to be taken off by the dentist, but to prevent it look in to Dr Ellie's mouthcare system if you don't ever want to visit the dentist.

You don't find that system to be too harsh on your mouth? It essentially eradicates the entire oral microbiome. Im sure its effective, but so are a lot of other toxic interventions that have to be "paid for" later. It doesnt seem like a good route to go long term, maybe as a nuke in an emergency scenario. Taking a systemic antibiotic like Ray had suggested may be a safer option if there are signs of infection.

 

[InChristAlone]

You don't find that system to be too harsh on your mouth? It essentially eradicates the entire oral microbiome. Im sure its effective, but so are a lot of other toxic interventions that have to be "paid for" later. It doesnt seem like a good route to go long term, maybe as a nuke in an emergency scenario. Taking a systemic antibiotic like Ray had suggested may be a safer option if there are signs of infection.

She has her whole family doing it. Including children. She says she's been doing it for decades and hasn't needed to go to the dentist even for a cleaning. I don't form much plaque while doing it. I can't do the xylitol though because it causes acid reflux. I would much rather swish something for a minute than take a systemic antibiotic that only works while you are taking it.

 

[RealNeat]

She has her whole family doing it. Including children. She says she's been doing it for decades and hasn't needed to go to the dentist even for a cleaning. I don't form much plaque while doing it. I can't do the xylitol though because it causes acid reflux. I would much rather swish something for a minute than take a systemic antibiotic that only works while you are taking it.

I think this protocol only works while you are doing it too. I understand the desire to avoid a systemic antibiotic but my point is that you would be taking an antibiotic for your mouth (alcohol) every day with her protocol, Instead one could follow a more biocompatible protocol with substances like hydroxyapatite and if that failed them later and they, for some reason, got a gnarly infection, they could take a transient antibiotic until further intervention was made possible. I wouldnt want to be dependent on 2 products that contain fluoride and alcohol every day. Im not trying to give anyone a hard time, dont get me wrong, I'm just not convinced that her approach is as benign as its being made out to be in the alt health realm. It seems good for people who may be pressed for money or availability of better products. Then again powdered egg shell + baking soda, which is extremely available, seems to work almost as well as hydroxyapatite for remineralization.

Like i said i dont doubt the efficacy of the protocol, fluoride is pretty good at making teeth very acid resistant and Listerine is a very potent microbial inhibitor and almost an herbal preparation. I jsut think its subpar for long term safety in terms of effects on the thyroid and oral tissue.

The data on xylitol is very poor, Im surprised at the amount of people who recommend it. Green tea seems to have a much more robust body of research behind it for carries prevention, independent of its naturally high fluoride content.

 

[RealNeat]

She has her whole family doing it. Including children. She says she's been doing it for decades and hasn't needed to go to the dentist even for a cleaning. I don't form much plaque while doing it. I can't do the xylitol though because it causes acid reflux. I would much rather swish something for a minute than take a systemic antibiotic that only works while you are taking it.

Also her daughters got fluorosis...

Fluorosis
"Thanks so much for your interest, and your suggestion about fluorosis. Your recommendation would be good for a child with newly discovered problems – my kids had veneers to correct their major issues. Sad as it was – I guess this problem directed me to investigate fluoride in detail – and see there is good and bad in the story. In retrospect – I am happy to have learned the truth and be able to pass this along to people all over the world." - Ellie

 

[user8374]

I had some tooth pain and bleeding and problems with my gums and a month of doing oregano tea mouthwash did the trick. Its very good at killing the bacteria and relieving pain and inflammation. Would definitely recommend that you try it. Message me if you'd like more info.

 

[Mossy]

I had some tooth pain and bleeding and problems with my gums and a month of doing oregano tea mouthwash did the trick. Its very good at killing the bacteria and relieving pain and inflammation. Would definitely recommend that you try it. Message me if you'd like more info.

Would you mind posting for all to see how you used the oregano tea? Was it as simple as making oregano tea and rinsing with it? Thank you.

 

[user8374]

Would you mind posting for all to see how you used the oregano tea? Was it as simple as making oregano tea and rinsing with it? Thank you.

Use 1-2 tablespoons depending on the oregano variety. Let it steep for around 30 minutes and then use it like you would use mouthwash. It should burn inside your mouth only a little which means it will be effective. Try not to eat for a few hours after doing this.

 

[RealNeat]

Use 1-2 tablespoons depending on the oregano variety. Let it steep for around 30 minutes and then use it like you would use mouthwash. It should burn inside your mouth only a little which means it will be effective. Try not to eat for a few hours after doing this.

Turkish oregano is the most potent, I've tried the Mexican variety and others and they just taste like herbal tea with no medicinal feel

 

[InChristAlone]

I think this protocol only works while you are doing it too. I understand the desire to avoid a systemic antibiotic but my point is that you would be taking an antibiotic for your mouth (alcohol) every day with her protocol, Instead one could follow a more biocompatible protocol with substances like hydroxyapatite and if that failed them later and they, for some reason, got a gnarly infection, they could take a transient antibiotic until further intervention was made possible. I wouldnt want to be dependent on 2 products that contain fluoride and alcohol every day. Im not trying to give anyone a hard time, dont get me wrong, I'm just not convinced that her approach is as benign as its being made out to be in the alt health realm. It seems good for people who may be pressed for money or availability of better products. Then again powdered egg shell + baking soda, which is extremely available, seems to work almost as well as hydroxyapatite for remineralization.

Like i said i dont doubt the efficacy of the protocol, fluoride is pretty good at making teeth very acid resistant and Listerine is a very potent microbial inhibitor and almost an herbal preparation. I jsut think its subpar for long term safety in terms of effects on the thyroid and oral tissue.

The data on xylitol is very poor, Im surprised at the amount of people who recommend it. Green tea seems to have a much more robust body of research behind it for carries prevention, independent of its naturally high fluoride content.

My point was systemic antibiotics don't effect the oral microbiome and harm the gut microbiome leading to dysbiosis. Dr Ellie said the microbiome of the mouth is protected by biofilm. We don't have enough research to know what changes this biofilm but it comes back rapidly. What we are doing is preventing strep mutans from destroying the enamel.

I was anti-fluoride for 15 yrs. I have three missing teeth now and a root canal. Nearly all my teeth have decay. Will never believe internet users for the health of my teeth again. Dr Ellie has spent her life's research trying to care for people's teeth.

She wishes these products were more 'safe' but she can't find any other protocol or product to recommend for the treatment of gum disease and decay. And I'd agree. I tried many products. None of them are as effective at making my mouth healthy. Including hydroxyapatite. K2 basically did nothing either. I know I have strep mutans. Very hard to eradicate.

Also her daughters got fluorosis...

Fluorosis
"Thanks so much for your interest, and your suggestion about fluorosis. Your recommendation would be good for a child with newly discovered problems – my kids had veneers to correct their major issues. Sad as it was – I guess this problem directed me to investigate fluoride in detail – and see there is good and bad in the story. In retrospect – I am happy to have learned the truth and be able to pass this along to people all over the world." - Ellie

This was taken out of context, I haven't heard this story but it seems in connection with drinking fluoridated water which causes fluorosis. She said she is working to help get fluoride out of the water. She only recommends sodium fluoride in crest toothpaste and ACT fluoride rinse. Anything else is damaging. The sodium salt is way safer than the fluoro chemicals in water. Stannous fluoride also seems more dangerous which is in other toothpastes.

 

[RealNeat]

My point was systemic antibiotics don't effect the oral microbiome and harm the gut microbiome leading to dysbiosis. Dr Ellie said the microbiome of the mouth is protected by biofilm. We don't have enough research to know what changes this biofilm but it comes back rapidly. What we are doing is preventing strep mutans from destroying the enamel.

I was anti-fluoride for 15 yrs. I have three missing teeth now and a root canal. Nearly all my teeth have decay. Will never believe internet users for the health of my teeth again. Dr Ellie has spent her life's research trying to care for people's teeth.

She wishes these products were more 'safe' but she can't find any other protocol or product to recommend for the treatment of gum disease and decay. And I'd agree. I tried many products. None of them are as effective at making my mouth healthy. Including hydroxyapatite. K2 basically did nothing either. I know I have strep mutans. Very hard to eradicate.

This was taken out of context, I haven't heard this story but it seems in connection with drinking fluoridated water which causes fluorosis. She said she is working to help get fluoride out of the water. She only recommends sodium fluoride in crest toothpaste and ACT fluoride rinse. Anything else is damaging. The sodium salt is way safer than the fluoro chemicals in water. Stannous fluoride also seems more dangerous which is in other toothpastes.

There is plenty of examples of people with good teeth who never touched fluoride in their life. Both current examples, like myself, and the people that people like Weston A Price studied. What works for you is awesome I'm not debating you should be doing anything else, but there is more to the story than what Ellie hypothesizes is the issue.

The so called Ray Peat diet is terrible for teeth when practiced in most North American regions, we had talked before about the absence of vegetables as a contributor to your oral health.

Systemic antibiotics most definitely help eradicate oral issues without a direct disturbance to the oral microbiome, I have seen this in healing infections in the people around me with things like Augmentin, Ray has also mentioned this.

Most people brush their teeth far too infrequently, it doesn't matter if S Mutans is in your mouth, it just matters if they have fuel to metabolize aka leaving food in your mouth and it's crevices, almost everyone has S Mutans. It's another microbial scapegoat. I think people should be brushing minimum 5 times a day, with a non oral microbiome disrupting substance or the miswak.

Yes I'm just a guy on the Internet but I base my views on people just as if not more est established in science than Ellie, who after all is another person someone found through studying in the Internet.

In my previous response I missed an antibiotic she recommends which is closys. So she uses alcohol, essential oils (Listerine) and essentially bleach to "clean" the mouth, yet bashes things like green tea and sodium bicarbonate as beneficial biofilm disrupters, quite the claim considering the nukes she herself uses.

How is it possible she knows the microbiome comes back if she recommends this as a ongoing treatment... guaranteed eventually without this protocol the mouth will be more susceptible to both infection, tooth decay and oral cancer.

Once again not an attempt to say what you are doing is wrong, but just in case other people read and wonder why I'm not 100% on board with her.