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Haidut said:Based on Dr. Drisko's bio and research I suspect that the study was done as combination of chemo and vitamin C simply because otherwise it would not have gotten funding or approval had it been vitamin C only. It is actually a common trick used by biochemist who want to test a new/experimental substance - i.e. do a trial with the new substance combined with established treatment and if the new substance shows additive effects with the established treatment then argue for a separate trial. Been there, done that
mark74 said:Some folks believe Vitamin C "cures" cancer taking 5000mg of vitamin C everyday and think that's going to help.
It might have been this interview: 2012-10-19 Antioxidants - Andrew Murray + Ray Peat.narouz said:post 37689 A while back I listened to a Peat interview in which he discussed Vitamin C.
I believe it was a KMUD interview.
Peat strongly advised against taking supplemental C.
I can't recall exactly what he said,
but I believe he said doing so resulted in a huge amount of iron absorbed into the organism.
And I don't think Peat said it was because the supplements necessarily contained iron themselves.
It was because of a reaction of the C with...can't recall.
Giraffe said:post 110276It might have been this interview: 2012-10-19 Antioxidants - Andrew Murray + Ray Peat.narouz said:post 37689 A while back I listened to a Peat interview in which he discussed Vitamin C.
I believe it was a KMUD interview.
Peat strongly advised against taking supplemental C.
I can't recall exactly what he said,
but I believe he said doing so resulted in a huge amount of iron absorbed into the organism.
And I don't think Peat said it was because the supplements necessarily contained iron themselves.
It was because of a reaction of the C with...can't recall.
The part about vitamin C starts at around the 20 minutes mark. A transcription of that part is posted here post 92653.
narouz said:post 110298Giraffe said:post 110276It might have been this interview: 2012-10-19 Antioxidants - Andrew Murray + Ray Peat.narouz said:post 37689 A while back I listened to a Peat interview in which he discussed Vitamin C.
I believe it was a KMUD interview.
Peat strongly advised against taking supplemental C.
I can't recall exactly what he said,
but I believe he said doing so resulted in a huge amount of iron absorbed into the organism.
And I don't think Peat said it was because the supplements necessarily contained iron themselves.
It was because of a reaction of the C with...can't recall.
The part about vitamin C starts at around the 20 minutes mark. A transcription of that part is posted here post 92653.
Yes, Giraffe, I remember that.
I once tried, here on the forum, to relate the same info from Peat and
like you
I was all fuzzy about how exactly Peat explained the iron connection.
So I went back to the interview--this was about a year ago--
and relistened
and got it exactly straight.
I meant to post that clarification at that point, but never got around to it.
Now...I'm all blurry about it again!
Seems to me that, maybe, it wasn't as simple as the supplement being contaminated with iron.
It might've been something like the form of the vitamin C,
when ingested and metabolized,
had the effect of releasing iron already in the body--maybe in a safer form before,
and then turning it into a dangerous form.
I confused the hell out of me,
but I think I finally got it straight.
Only to have it recede now into the mists....
haidut said:post 110302narouz said:post 110298Giraffe said:post 110276It might have been this interview: 2012-10-19 Antioxidants - Andrew Murray + Ray Peat.narouz said:post 37689 A while back I listened to a Peat interview in which he discussed Vitamin C.
I believe it was a KMUD interview.
Peat strongly advised against taking supplemental C.
I can't recall exactly what he said,
but I believe he said doing so resulted in a huge amount of iron absorbed into the organism.
And I don't think Peat said it was because the supplements necessarily contained iron themselves.
It was because of a reaction of the C with...can't recall.
The part about vitamin C starts at around the 20 minutes mark. A transcription of that part is posted here post 92653.
I always thought the dangers of vitamin C are pretty straighforward - 1) it dramatically increases absorption of iron from food and 2) it reduces iron already stored in the body. Vitamin C is a reductant. Reduced iron is what you see on food labels as an additive and it is highly reactive and damaging. I think a popular theory right now even in mainstream medicine is that excessive reduced iron can directly cause Parkinson disease.
Am I missing something?
Nicholas said:post 110312 this info. is still fuzzy....when people say "Vitamin C" are they talking about ascorbic acid or are they talking about vitamin C that is in food? If meat and potatoes both have "Vitamin C", then meat dramatically increases its own iron absorption in the body? I think the last quote i heard of Peat regarding vitamin C was this:
"“The antioxidants in our body have to fit together with uric acid which is naturally there, and enzymes which naturally break down free radicals. And if you put things in that don’t fit, apparent antioxidants in a test tube can become a pro-oxidant in a body. Things have to fit together, so that vitamin A and vitamin E are locked together and vitamin E and vit. C locked together, Uric acid and vit.C locked together and the glucose and other sugars have to be streaming through the systems of enzymes turning into carbon dioxide. Carbon dioxide has to be flowing out of the cells properly."
from this quote, it appears that Peat is saying only food sources of Vit. C are antioxidants. He seems to imply that supplemental "vitamin C" (there's no specification as to whether it's ascorbic acid or whole-food vitamin C supplement) is pro-oxidant. The studies i have seen are more concerned with the *amount* of supplemental vitamin C (can only assume ascorbic acid) being the factor which causes oxidation and releasing stored iron.
I wouldn't use it. I was concerned even with less than 3 ppm heavy metals. Which I did use and noticed benefits from but Ray says it's the contamination that destroys the benefits of taking it.Is this too much heavy metal?
I wouldn't use it. I was concerned even with less than 3 ppm heavy metals. Which I did use and noticed benefits from but Ray says it's the contamination that destroys the benefits of taking it.
ray peat on dietary C: "If fats and starches in the diet are low, the vitamin C content of the diet will generally be around 3000 mg per day. Milk, mushrooms, meats, etc., all provide vitamin C. I don’t know of a food-based vitamin C that doesn’t contain added synthetic ascorbic acid."