Adrenal Fatigue And Hypothyroid

[Abc123]

Hello all!

I am struggling with Adrenal Fatigue, Hypothyroid, and Hashimoto's. My symptoms are Low Morning Cortisol, Low DHEA, Low Thyroid Function, Fatigue, Zero Sex Drive, Brain Fog, etc..

Do you have any good tips for healing adrenals? From what I read it's best to stay away from Sugar. And also stay away from caffeine. Is it possible to fix adrenal fatigue with Peating? (High Sugar?)

I'm current taking Pansterone 4 drops (x2 am, x2 noon)
Armour Thyroid 2grains + 50mcg T3 (May need more)
Selenium, B Vitamins, P5P 50mg, Zinc 30mg, Vit D 10,000iu, Kuinone 4.5mg, Magnesium 800mg
HCL with Pepsin (At each Meal)
Adaptocrine K2 -

• Vitamin C (as Ascorbic Acid) 100 mg

• Panax Ginseng Extract (root) 200 mg

• Ashwagandha Extract (root) 200 mg

• Holy Basil Extract (leaf) 100 mg

• Rhodiola Extract (root) 75 mg

• Eleuthero Extract (root) 50 mg

• Pantethine 50 mg

• Proprietary Blend: 78 mg* of Boerhavia extract root, Betaine HCI, Cellulase (plant enzyme), Peptidase (plant enzyme)

Recently I cut out all sugar from the diet. With the sugar in my diet I would feel warm and hot. I know that sugar is great for thyroid function. But is it burning out my adrenals and not allowing them to heal? I have done a 4x salvia test and morning cortisol is very low. Getting up in the morning is so hard no matter how long I've slept. Also SHBG is high and liver enzymes are elevated.

Thank you all in advance!

 

[Abc123]

Skipped coffee today and didn't get the hypoglycemic feeling post consumption. I wonder if this issue I have is mainly from the adrenals?

 

[managing]

Hello all!

I am struggling with Adrenal Fatigue, Hypothyroid, and Hashimoto's. My symptoms are Low Morning Cortisol, Low DHEA, Low Thyroid Function, Fatigue, Zero Sex Drive, Brain Fog, etc..

Do you have any good tips for healing adrenals? From what I read it's best to stay away from Sugar. And also stay away from caffeine. Is it possible to fix adrenal fatigue with Peating? (High Sugar?)

I'm current taking Pansterone 4 drops (x2 am, x2 noon)
Armour Thyroid 2grains + 50mcg T3 (May need more)
Selenium, B Vitamins, P5P 50mg, Zinc 30mg, Vit D 10,000iu, Kuinone 4.5mg, Magnesium 800mg
HCL with Pepsin (At each Meal)
Adaptocrine K2 -

• Vitamin C (as Ascorbic Acid) 100 mg

• Panax Ginseng Extract (root) 200 mg

• Ashwagandha Extract (root) 200 mg

• Holy Basil Extract (leaf) 100 mg

• Rhodiola Extract (root) 75 mg

• Eleuthero Extract (root) 50 mg

• Pantethine 50 mg

• Proprietary Blend: 78 mg* of Boerhavia extract root, Betaine HCI, Cellulase (plant enzyme), Peptidase (plant enzyme)

Recently I cut out all sugar from the diet. With the sugar in my diet I would feel warm and hot. I know that sugar is great for thyroid function. But is it burning out my adrenals and not allowing them to heal? I have done a 4x salvia test and morning cortisol is very low. Getting up in the morning is so hard no matter how long I've slept. Also SHBG is high and liver enzymes are elevated.

Thank you all in advance!

Thyroid. Get it right before all else. Stop taking everything else. Consider Tyromix and possibly cynomel/cynoplus. Get thyroid right first.

 

[Bodhi]

Disagree totally.....

Start with Peat inspired eating for 4 years, lower your PUFAS and increase protein an carbs...
After this 4 years do a full panel : Estrogen/Progesterone, Thyroid /anti Tpo, etc etc...

Add supplements like Thyroid hormones and the rest according to your panels.....
But study RP first, your questions show you did not, Hasimotos and ADF do not exist ....

Its eater auto immune related which is closely related to high estrogen or just low metabolism

 

[Lurker]

Your best bet is to heed what your body is telling you and slow down, chill out and reduce stress. Easier said than done I know.

I think most of the advice says to fix adrenals and then work on thyroid. They are both crushed by stress though.

 

[Abc123]

I've been reading the adrenals should be fix first and then thyroid. It's been days off of caffeine. I've been pretty cold all day. I'm increasing my T3 to 75mcg and hopefully it warms me up. I strength train 4x per week with heavy compound movements. On the 3 Off days from training I would do some walking.

I'm taking in Maintenance calories. But I feel I could need more calories. Today was a rest day and I didn't feel too bad.

I started Licorice Root which I will be taking in the mornings to help with my low cortisol. Waking up in the morning is rough!

 

[alywest]

I've been reading the adrenals should be fix first and then thyroid. It's been days off of caffeine. I've been pretty cold all day. I'm increasing my T3 to 75mcg and hopefully it warms me up. I strength train 4x per week with heavy compound movements. On the 3 Off days from training I would do some walking.

I'm taking in Maintenance calories. But I feel I could need more calories. Today was a rest day and I didn't feel too bad.

I started Licorice Root which I will be taking in the mornings to help with my low cortisol. Waking up in the morning is rough!

It seems somewhat counterintuitive to strength train when you feel that your adrenals are in such bad shape. Perhaps give yourself a break from the intense exercising and focus on restoring your health. If you get your metabolism going right, you can achieve a lean build and even become more muscular without all the strenuous activity. Of course if you really want to strength train that should be the goal, but your liver is probably totally depleted of glycogen which means you have no energy reserves. Eating fructose allows you to build up your glycogen stores and keep your blood sugar up without releasing insulin. Start with OJ, and go from there. Coffee and eggs both lower your blood sugar so if you have either of those for breakfast eat some sort of carbs. I used to feel so awful when I woke up that I couldn't even imagine getting out of bed and yet I would have to to go to work. Now I wake up and I'm tired but it's a normal tired. When your thyroid is low it affects everything else, as managing said. t3 is great but if you're not giving your body a chance to really heal, it's never going to help you. Work on your diet, balance protein with carbs and some fat from healthy sources like coco oil, butter, olive oil. These things will restore you, not power lifting at the gym.

 

[managing]

Your best bet is to heed what your body is telling you and slow down, chill out and reduce stress. Easier said than done I know.

I think most of the advice says to fix adrenals and then work on thyroid. They are both crushed by stress though.

I don't disagree. Except adrenal-thyroid are co-dependent systems. Fixing thyroid is relatively straightforward and fixing adrenals is not. Fix one, and the other will come in line*. If you have a perspective on fixing adrenals in a relatively straightforward manner, I'm interested in hearing it.

Regardless, the OP needs to cut way down on things and keep it simple and progressive.

*As long as you are eating well, reducing stress, etc.

 

[managing]

I've been reading the adrenals should be fix first and then thyroid. It's been days off of caffeine. I've been pretty cold all day. I'm increasing my T3 to 75mcg and hopefully it warms me up. I strength train 4x per week with heavy compound movements. On the 3 Off days from training I would do some walking.

I'm taking in Maintenance calories. But I feel I could need more calories. Today was a rest day and I didn't feel too bad.

I started Licorice Root which I will be taking in the mornings to help with my low cortisol. Waking up in the morning is rough!

Lots of things. First, as above, slow down. Take one thing at a time. You are doing so many things you can't possibly figure out what is hurting and what is helping. Just becuse a blog somewhere says it will do xyz doesn't mean it will. The body is complex and unique from one to another.

Strength training is great. As long as it is low impact and not "to failure".

T3. 75mcg. When? that is much more important than how much.

Yes, you probably need more calories. Sugar and starch will reduce stress. Do you do well with OJ? Can you squeeze it yourself?

Licorice. Not a great choice for a variety of reasons. Have you tried the circadian T3 method?

 

[Abc123]

It seems somewhat counterintuitive to strength train when you feel that your adrenals are in such bad shape. Perhaps give yourself a break from the intense exercising and focus on restoring your health. If you get your metabolism going right, you can achieve a lean build and even become more muscular without all the strenuous activity. Of course if you really want to strength train that should be the goal, but your liver is probably totally depleted of glycogen which means you have no energy reserves. Eating fructose allows you to build up your glycogen stores and keep your blood sugar up without releasing insulin. Start with OJ, and go from there. Coffee and eggs both lower your blood sugar so if you have either of those for breakfast eat some sort of carbs. I used to feel so awful when I woke up that I couldn't even imagine getting out of bed and yet I would have to to go to work. Now I wake up and I'm tired but it's a normal tired. When your thyroid is low it affects everything else, as managing said. t3 is great but if you're not giving your body a chance to really heal, it's never going to help you. Work on your diet, balance protein with carbs and some fat from healthy sources like coco oil, butter, olive oil. These things will restore you, not power lifting at the gym.

Yeah I've really noticed when I eat eggs or have coffee I get really cold after. I do consume a lot of coconut butter and coconut oil. Macros are about 100F/300C/200P. I'm going to take a break this week from training. I used to do well with orange juice but not anymore. Possibly due to low metabolism?

Lots of things. First, as above, slow down. Take one thing at a time. You are doing so many things you can't possibly figure out what is hurting and what is helping. Just becuse a blog somewhere says it will do xyz doesn't mean it will. The body is complex and unique from one to another.

Strength training is great. As long as it is low impact and not "to failure".

T3. 75mcg. When? that is much more important than how much.

Yes, you probably need more calories. Sugar and starch will reduce stress. Do you do well with OJ? Can you squeeze it yourself?

Licorice. Not a great choice for a variety of reasons. Have you tried the circadian T3 method?

I have just started experimenting with the Circadian T3 method. I get up at about 7am. I set my alarm for 5am and take 25mcg T3. Should I take more T3 at this time? This mornings temp i was 97.2 and about 3pm I'm 97.4*. I know I definitely must need more thyroid. I want to try Orange Juice again but from what I read about adrenal fatigue is that sugar and too high of carbohydrates is bad. Then if I do go too low in carbs i feel worse. It's been a tough battle for years! I'm so desperate to get better.

I've also taken a stool sample test and should have results back on wednesday to see if I have any chronic infections. It's been too long since I've ever felt good.

Thank you to everyone that Is taking the time to help me!

 

[alywest]

Try putting a little bit of salt in your oj. Just sip it slowly throughout the day. Don't chug it! That can still raise your blood sugar too high even if it's not creating an insulin response. Are you also taking t4? Peat says you should take t4 if you're taking t3. I actually have to have a 1:1 ratio sometimes when I don't feel the t4 is converting to t3 at all. Otherwise do 2:1 or 3:1 (t4:t3)

Have you been balancing out your protein with glycine (as in gelatin and/or collagen?) That is a big part of the puzzle. I would also cut out all the herbs except maybe rhodiola for now. You are giving your body a lot of different things and herbs can be powerful medications. Take it easy until you start to improve thyroid function and the adrenals will follow. Adrenals can actually heal quite nicely by they need rest and time. Be kind to yourself! If you overwork your liver, you're not going to make any progress.

 

[Abc123]

Try putting a little bit of salt in your oj. Just sip it slowly throughout the day. Don't chug it! That can still raise your blood sugar too high even if it's not creating an insulin response. Are you also taking t4? Peat says you should take t4 if you're taking t3. I actually have to have a 1:1 ratio sometimes when I don't feel the t4 is converting to t3 at all. Otherwise do 2:1 or 3:1 (t4:t3)

Have you been balancing out your protein with glycine (as in gelatin and/or collagen?) That is a big part of the puzzle. I would also cut out all the herbs except maybe rhodiola for now. You are giving your body a lot of different things and herbs can be powerful medications. Take it easy until you start to improve thyroid function and the adrenals will follow. Adrenals can actually heal quite nicely by they need rest and time. Be kind to yourself! If you overwork your liver, you're not going to make any progress.

Yes I do sip the Orange Juice Slowly. I do have elevated Liver Enzymes and High SHBG. If seems I do have a sluggish liver.

Im taking 1.5grains of Armour + 75mcg of T3. It seems like no matter how much T3 I take my feet stay freezing cold. Hopefully the stool test results will comeback with something that will make sense of all this!

 

[alywest]

You might want to try some milk thistle to support your liver. Supposedly up to 500 mgs is not estrogenic. Also, have you tried aspirin? I noticed you're already taking K2 so you should be able to take plenty of aspirin without fear. It seems to keep me warmer, especially my feet.

Also, what brand of t3 are you using? Generic prescription t3 is awful. I like tyronene (idealabs) and I think managing brought up cytomel. It really does make all the difference. If you can't get the t3 to your cells, it's useless.

Also you should really read this: Hypothyroidism and Adrenal Fatigue: Why Treating Your Adrenals Is Ruining Your Thyroid

 

[Abc123]

You might want to try some milk thistle to support your liver. Supposedly up to 500 mgs is not estrogenic. Also, have you tried aspirin? I noticed you're already taking K2 so you should be able to take plenty of aspirin without fear. It seems to keep me warmer, especially my feet.

Also, what brand of t3 are you using? Generic prescription t3 is awful. I like tyronene (idealabs) and I think managing brought up cytomel. It really does make all the difference. If you can't get the t3 to your cells, it's useless.

Also you should really read this: Hypothyroidism and Adrenal Fatigue: Why Treating Your Adrenals Is Ruining Your Thyroid

I have tried milk thistle and it didn't seem to do much for me. Yes I am taking generic Liothyronine prescribed by my doctor. I'm debating on having a big cup of coffee with plenty of sugar and cream as I feel that give me a big kickstart. I've been off all caffeine for 1 week. I did take aspirin in the past and didn't really notice anything. I was taking 325mg per day with coffee. I will read that forum you linked up above. Thank you!

 

[alywest]

I have tried milk thistle and it didn't seem to do much for me. Yes I am taking generic Liothyronine prescribed by my doctor. I'm debating on having a big cup of coffee with plenty of sugar and cream as I feel that give me a big kickstart. I've been off all caffeine for 1 week. I did take aspirin in the past and didn't really notice anything. I was taking 325mg per day with coffee. I will read that forum you linked up above. Thank you!

Generic liothyronine is useless. I took it for a while from a naturopath and didn't notice any improvement. It wasn't until a naturopath wrote on the prescription "do not substitute with generic cytomel" that I got the real deal. Not sure what the difference is but it is huge. If your doc won't request that (or your insurance won't cover it at all if it's not generic; it's pricey stuff at full price) I would try ordering from Mexico or try Haidut's tyronene (t3 only) and take several drops in the mouth throughout the day. I've found that it works better orally for me than transdermal because of my sluggish liver. Hope this all helps, I wasted too much time going through the same mistakes. Maybe try a higher dose of aspirin, too.

 

[Abc123]

Generic liothyronine is useless. I took it for a while from a naturopath and didn't notice any improvement. It wasn't until a naturopath wrote on the prescription "do not substitute with generic cytomel" that I got the real deal. Not sure what the difference is but it is huge. If your doc won't request that (or your insurance won't cover it at all if it's not generic; it's pricey stuff at full price) I would try ordering from Mexico or try Haidut's tyronene (t3 only) and take several drops in the mouth throughout the day. I've found that it works better orally for me than transdermal because of my sluggish liver. Hope this all helps, I wasted too much time going through the same mistakes. Maybe try a higher dose of aspirin, too.

Thank you so much! Yeah I feel like I could chew through an entire bottle of the thyroid meds like skittles lol. I should place an order with IdeaLabs. I do have the Pansterone which seems to work nicely! I like @haidut and all the valuable info he brings!

 

[alywest]

Thank you so much! Yeah I feel like I could chew through an entire bottle of the thyroid meds like skittles lol. I should place an order with IdeaLabs. I do have the Pansterone which seems to work nicely! I like @haidut and all the valuable info he brings!

You're welcome! People have helped me so much here, and I am glad I can help in some small way from my own experience. Haidut is great and I also like his Energin and Estroban.

 

[Abc123]

You're welcome! People have helped me so much here, and I am glad I can help in some small way from my own experience. Haidut is great and I also like his Energin and Estroban.

Thanks! I have used Estroban before as well and I didn't really notice any effects. I believe because my poor liver function it cannot detoxify estrogen properly.

 

[managing]

Yeah I've really noticed when I eat eggs or have coffee I get really cold after. I do consume a lot of coconut butter and coconut oil. Macros are about 100F/300C/200P. I'm going to take a break this week from training. I used to do well with orange juice but not anymore. Possibly due to low metabolism?




I have just started experimenting with the Circadian T3 method. I get up at about 7am. I set my alarm for 5am and take 25mcg T3. Should I take more T3 at this time? This mornings temp i was 97.2 and about 3pm I'm 97.4*. I know I definitely must need more thyroid. I want to try Orange Juice again but from what I read about adrenal fatigue is that sugar and too high of carbohydrates is bad. Then if I do go too low in carbs i feel worse. It's been a tough battle for years! I'm so desperate to get better.

I've also taken a stool sample test and should have results back on wednesday to see if I have any chronic infections. It's been too long since I've ever felt good.

Thank you to everyone that Is taking the time to help me!

I would say try less. Much less. That much T3 is probably dropping your blood sugar considerably. If you don't have adequate adrenal response it will lower your temps (like low 97s). And if you do, it will catabolize muscle. One Cynomel or similar is usually 25mcg. You should never take more than about 5 or 6 mcg at a time. One quarter Cynomel is 6.25mcg and is an acceptable upper limit.

Most of what you have read about carbs and adrenal fatigue is based on the assumption that people are insulin resistant. Taking thyroid in an appropriate manner will prevent that possibility. In which case, carbs at significant (but not unrestrained) levels will be no danger to you whatsoever. My whole read of the low carb craziness is "OK, if your metabolism is completely f'ud up and you aren't going to do anything about it, low carbs may (or may not) be less horribly damaging to your health than adequate carbs".

I would recommend considering @haidut product Tyromix. Applied topically, with meals, it has been a complete revelation for me. IdeaLabs Online Store - Worldwide Ordering And Delivery - Laboratory Research Chemicals. I use three drops with each meal. Theoretically, that is 9mcg at a time, but topical adsorption is slower and smooths this out.

 

[alywest]

I just came across this interview and thought this seemed relevant:

Josh Rubin: Ray, I got email from someone wondering about kind of starting a pro- thyroid like diet in regards to kind of what you recommend and just a couple of questions in relation to that. Does the body go through a detox when you begin that and what does it look like, would you see increased cholesterol?

Dr. Ray Peat: No, if a person has low cholesterol they shouldn't start a thyroid supplement full force because the thyroid is going to make you convert cholesterol into the liver bile acids and progesterone, pregnenolone and DHEA and so on. So very low cholesterol has to be fixed before you take very much thyroid, and the fruit is the best way to raise your cholesterol up to normal but if a person has at least normal cholesterol then they tolerate a thyroid supplement very well. And if you're just starting out with a diet change, the improvement of your thyroid function is going to be very gradual usually and the first thing is to lower the production of toxins in your intestine, for example, cutting out under cooked starches, salad, leaves and such that can’t be digested and may be using a fiber such as bamboo shoots or carrots that will have a germicidal action and then avoiding all kinds of polyunsaturated fats because at every stage of thyroid function, the polyunsaturated fats block the production of the thyroid hormone transport and stimulation of the energy production inside cells. And in a short period such as two or three hours after you eat saturated fat or coconut oil or sugar can do it sometimes, you can get a momentary activation of your thyroid that fades away as soon as you start drawing out the unsaturated fats from your tissues. But to have a complete conversion from a thyroid -suppressed state to a completely normal state can take two or three years if you’ve got a lot of fat stored in your tissues. Thin people can get their thyroid going much more quickly just with the diet.

Josh Rubin: Now if they start the diet and they see their cholesterol go up, will eventually go down or is that mean they have in deficiency in like selenium, glucose or T3?

Dr. Ray Peat: Well, the rising cholesterol usually means that their liver is getting enough energy to make it – that the toxins have gone down and the cholesterol is protective adaptive substance that is making up for this deficient pregnenolone, progesterone and DHEA. If your thyroid is low, you won't be converting it and so it will adaptively protect you by being high. There were studies – a Framingham study found that people over 50 who had cholesterol under 200 were more likely to have dementia and people with higher cholesterol and in a rest home, nursing home study, they found that the longest lived people averaged up around 270 to 280 cholesterol. And all kinds of animal experiments showed that you protect cells, brain cells, all kinds of cells by having plenty of cholesterol. It's really a protective factor against all kinds of disease.

East West: Questions & Answers I