My Week Off Caffeinated Coffee - Experience; Positives/Negatives

[jaywills]

Background: 23y.o male.

I would like to share my experiences of being caffeine free for a week. This post is not to demonise coffee, nor to debate whether coffee is beneficial to health. It is simply to provide a perspective, to rationalise an addiction that I believe I know have in check.

The initial point of this experiment was to improve my sleep, which was terrible on all days of high caffeineted coffee consumption. I would have nights of lying awake until 2-3am on these days. This was even with the coffee consumption at latest 12 noon and would only be 2 cups of filtered coffee in terms of strength. I even tried every sleep concoction remedy possible to try to sleep- salt, sugar, aspirin, thyroid, magnesium. Nothing would put me to sleep on those days.

I also felt incredibly stressed every time i consumed it. I would be very jittery and worked up and would mistake this for euphoria. Looking back I feel the caffeine was covering up deeper issues i could not access in a stimulated state. I.E the true state of my body was not being revealed, but covered by the stimulant.

I also tried a couple of days of decaf coffee, and felt all the positives found below

Note: no other variables outside of Coffee Consumption have been made - it is the only factor changed in the last week that have harvested the results below:

Positives\
- Considerably less anxious. My stress levels have dramatically reduced. Nail picking, which i have been accustomed to for several years, has declined in accordance to this reduction in caffeine.
- Sleep - related to the above but a considerable change none the less. My sleep has improved two-fold and I have been able to fall asleep minutes upon lying down.
- Hunger us returning. I genuinely feel hungry at times of the day, which has been absent during my coffee drinking days
- Manic racing thoughts have subsided.
- Facial Hair Growth - I think this is androgen related. I am not sure whether this is due to the removal of caffeine, or that the above positives of better sleep and less stress (from reduced caffeine) has caused my facial hair growth to be thicker and quicker growing.

Negatives
- Water Retention, slight fat gain - I have been holding a lot more water so i believe it is more the former than the latter. This seems unrelated to salt consumption.
- Fatigue; my energy has dramatically dipped, but this is to be expected by reducing a stimulant.
- Caffeine Withdrawal phase - absolutely f****ng horrendous. No other words to describe it. Lasted three days - felt ill, faint and nauseous. I had an episode of light headiness which i nearly collapsed. But once this phase has passed, I feel a lot better and my energy is returning.
- Mood - has been a lot more negative; bordering on depression. I believe this is brain chemical related and the enhancing effects of coffee on the brain,
- Enjoyment - I love the taste of coffee, and is one of the few things I enjoy. Taking this away has been difficult and felt as if i am missing out on something that improves my mood.
Alcohol and Hungover - After a night of heavy drinking I have has the worst hangover in years. My alcohol consumption mirrors the levels i have had on previous nights and felt fine the next morning. I believe this could be liver related, and the reduction in liver cleansing via coffee has made my detoxification of alcohol more prominent and less effective. Perhaps my liver is functioning more poorly.



Thoughts/Takeaways
- Caffeine no doubt effects sleep. Some people remove caffeine from their system a lot quicker than others. Me being on the slow side. Caffeine simply lingers in my system far beyond 8 hours after drinking.
- Caffeine has pronounced effects on mood, energy and outlook.
- Coffee is brilliant for the liver and detoxification.
- Decaf Coffee can provide many of the benefits without those negatives of caffeine.
- You should always challenge the deeper underlying issue and not to try to cover up with supplements and stimulants.
- Coffee is and can be abused, and caffeine is ultimately a drug. It can do more harm than good.
- Caffeine should be consumed in relation to the health of the consumer. Just because one person can drink 6 cups withouts the negatives I experienced above, does not mean that others, myself included, can adopt the same approach.
- Its good to take a break and unwind.

I hope this helps all those who feel addicted to coffee, or feel obliged to drink it. Perhaps a better approach is to test and assess on your own body and see what works for you. For me, life without coffee has its ups and its downs.

 

[InChristAlone]

Thanks for sharing your experience. I had to quit coffee over the winter due to an ongoing adrenaline/cortisol issue to the point I was having a nervous breakdown after a little bit of it. I felt so much more calm after the withdrawal. But ultimately w/o coffee I craved caffeine in sodas instead because I had such low energy w/o it. I did some healing with cypro and was able to add it back in a month ago but I'm feeling some negative symptoms again. It definitely has its positives and negatives.

 

[Tarmander]

This was great, thanks for sharing your experience. I too had some of the draw backs of caffeine and one of the peat things I can't quite wrap my head around is his recommendation of it. But obviously some people really use it well so I dunno.

 

[damngoodcoffee]

I'd like to try quitting coffee cause it makes me feel tired. I've been a regular coffee drinker for few years now but i've always thought that something about coffee is a bit iffy..
I feel more energetic and clear headed without it. I feel fresh and clean without it. Or something like that..
Sometimes it's nice that it makes me feel so relaxed but overall it's not fun to be tired all day.
I do love it so it ain't easy to quit it.
Has anybody quit coffee entirely?

 

[jyb]

Has anybody quit coffee entirely?

I cut it out a few weeks ago and didn't notice anything. Funny to see the wild difference in withdrawal experience. But I'm biased, I only cut it out as a test because I didn't see much point in drinking it in the first place (ok, other than for the taste and for the few minutes of dopamine).

 

[lindsay]

Positives\
- Considerably less anxious. My stress levels have dramatically reduced. Nail picking, which i have been accustomed to for several years, has declined in accordance to this reduction in caffeine.
- Sleep - related to the above but a considerable change none the less. My sleep has improved two-fold and I have been able to fall asleep minutes upon lying down.
- Hunger us returning. I genuinely feel hungry at times of the day, which has been absent during my coffee drinking days
- Manic racing thoughts have subsided.
- Facial Hair Growth - I think this is androgen related. I am not sure whether this is due to the removal of caffeine, or that the above positives of better sleep and less stress (from reduced caffeine) has caused my facial hair growth to be thicker and quicker growing.

First of all, thank you for sharing your experience :) It's always interesting to see how coffee really affects us. My husband stopped drinking it years ago for many of the above reasons you mentioned - caffeine gives him severe adrenaline rushes, even tea in small amounts will too.

Just to note what you wrote above as the positive notes, I stopped drinking regular drip coffee years ago and opted for espresso - stovetop, cheap "machine," and now I finally have a new nice machine I got for Christmas. I can genuinely say that drinking espresso was a game-changer for me. I noticed this summer when I was away and had to rely on regular coffee that my nails were breaking like crazy. Came home and went back to my espresso and they were nice and strong and long again.

Anyhow, espresso has a way higher magnesium content, which tends to alleviate the caffeine rush. I actually am inclined to take a nap after a cup of espresso - not so with drip coffee, which makes me feel "meh". I also drink it with a decent amount of sugar and cream.

So, just in case you do decide to go back to coffee, I would get a little stove-top espresso pot and see how it goes. Once I tried one of those, there was no going back.

 

[dookie]

The whole coffee topic is very interesting to me. I'm sure that caffeine tolerance is something that is "flexible", and can decrease or increase over time, depending on your health. Maybe someone who is sensitive to 1 cup of coffee will never be able to drink 6 cups per day, but some increase in tolerance is definitely possible. Having a well functioning liver, full of glycogen, is probably the most important thing, along with bowel function. Orange juice seems to mitigate some of the negative effects of coffee for me (even though I'm somewhat allergic to citrus fruits), and I also found that the antibiotic minocycline increases my caffeine tolerance.

 

[Peata]

First of all, thank you for sharing your experience :) It's always interesting to see how coffee really affects us. My husband stopped drinking it years ago for many of the above reasons you mentioned - caffeine gives him severe adrenaline rushes, even tea in small amounts will too.

Just to note what you wrote above as the positive notes, I stopped drinking regular drip coffee years ago and opted for espresso - stovetop, cheap "machine," and now I finally have a new nice machine I got for Christmas. I can genuinely say that drinking espresso was a game-changer for me. I noticed this summer when I was away and had to rely on regular coffee that my nails were breaking like crazy. Came home and went back to my espresso and they were nice and strong and long again.

Anyhow, espresso has a way higher magnesium content, which tends to alleviate the caffeine rush. I actually am inclined to take a nap after a cup of espresso - not so with drip coffee, which makes me feel "meh". I also drink it with a decent amount of sugar and cream.

So, just in case you do decide to go back to coffee, I would get a little stove-top espresso pot and see how it goes. Once I tried one of those, there was no going back.

Lindsay, what espresso machine do you use? Do you make it any particular way?

 

[Uselis]

Hey,

I am also really curious about coffee. Personally I drink 3-5 cups a day and feel only benefits from it, no side effects. But... I wonder is this addiction/escapism in broader sense? The moment I stop drinking it I get strong headaches and loose kick for my daily routines. No mojo for awhile so to speak. Physically I believe it does me good but psychologically I am dependent on it. Does anyone think it is addiction/escapism in that sense?

 

[javin]

Some coffee (especially cold brew) puts me way over the edge and nothing can stop the adrenaline from pumping. Sometimes it makes my hands go cold and I need to eat massive amounts of food to warm up. If I take a regular coffee with lots of milk and sugar I tend to do a lot better. One cup a day after a meal is more than enough for me.

 

[lollipop]

This coffee has no on ramp nor off ramp. People who could not handle the caffeine were able to drink this without any side affects. If you scroll down and read about it, the high ph seems to be a factor. My husband and I are drinking daily and even if we stop after months and months of use, NO withdrawal symptoms or adverse effects from not drinking. Good stuff...

Food for the Immortals Longevity Coffee Light Roast, 12 oz | Longevity Warehouse

 

[lindsay]

Lindsay, what espresso machine do you use? Do you make it any particular way?

My husband got me the Classic Gaggia for Christmas (Amazon.com: Gaggia 14101 Classic Espresso Machine, Brushed Stainless Steel: Kitchen & Dining).

It was a big deal for me, as espresso machines aren't cheap. But I love it and use it all the time. I average about 4 or 5 shots of espresso per day and it makes a beautiful frothy crema with the right grind of beans (although, I go and "ruin" it by putting cream in!). I'm not a super coffee snob, but my friends always comment on how good my coffee is when they come over (probably because I serve it with cream instead of milk) In the morning, I usually drink two shots (4 oz.) with two heaping teaspoons full of sugar and about 1/3 cup of half & half. I have at least 2 or 3 more shots with cream and sugar throughout the day, so 8 to 10 oz. total of espresso, which has about 500 mg of caffeine, 200 mg of magnesium, 12 mg of Niacin, and almost 0.5 mg of Riboflavin. I find it energizing and calming at the same time. Wakes my brain up without getting the jitters. Although, after listening to the more recent interview with RP on Danny Roddy's podcast, I think I will experiment with cold brew coffee too - for the antioxidants. Hope that helps!

 

[Peater Piper]

I've never been a coffee drinker, but tried it for about a month. It turns out I like the taste, and it did give me a small boost in energy. No issues with adrenaline. However, I had a definite diuretic effect from it that never went away. Also, I have some mild eczema or something like it on my fingers that's only ever been an issue in the dead of winter with the dry heat and hand washing doing a number on them. Moisturizing for a few nights always fixed the issue. By the end of the month drinking coffee my hands were a mess and moisturizing was doing nothing. My forehead was also broken out, and acne isn't normal for me. I don't know if it was the caffeine, something else in the coffee, or possibly mycotoxins or pesticides from using a cheap brand. It could have even been a coincidence, but it's been about a week since I stopped and my hands and forehead have healed. I'll probably try it again in a few months, perhaps with a better brand.

 

[PowertothePeatple]

Originally I could not even have a cup of coffee without jitters but because of the benefits I really wanted to try to make it work for me. I now drink 3-5 cups, no problem. But I took my time increasing dose. I notice people on here will try to go from none to 5 cups a day in a matter of weeks. It literally took me a year of drinking 1 cup a day until I could drink 2. Then after drinking 2 for at least 6 months I was able to go to 3-4 easily. And of all the Ray Peat things I have tried I think it made the biggest difference for me. But I think so many people rush it.

 

[Dopamine]

Great post. Thank you!

 

[Jsaute21]

@lisaferraro I ordered that food for immortals coffee...i have never tasted better coffee or felt better after drinking coffee in my life. Absolutely no crash and a very healthy, even buzz. I am a big coffee buff and have tried all of the "most organic brands". None compare. Bravo and great find. I suggest others to spend the $. Its that much better.

 

[lollipop]

@lisaferraro I ordered that food for immortals coffee...i have never tasted better coffee or felt better after drinking coffee in my life. Absolutely no crash and a very healthy, even buzz. I am a big coffee buff and have tried all of the "most organic brands". None compare. Bravo and great find. I suggest others to spend the $. Its that much better.

Aaaaawwwww....thank you @Jsaute21! It is simply BEST out there hands down. It kills me seeing all these sweet people suffering from coffee. They simply do not have to. Soooo hard to convince people...

 

[InChristAlone]

Originally I could not even have a cup of coffee without jitters but because of the benefits I really wanted to try to make it work for me. I now drink 3-5 cups, no problem. But I took my time increasing dose. I notice people on here will try to go from none to 5 cups a day in a matter of weeks. It literally took me a year of drinking 1 cup a day until I could drink 2. Then after drinking 2 for at least 6 months I was able to go to 3-4 easily. And of all the Ray Peat things I have tried I think it made the biggest difference for me. But I think so many people rush it.

Yeah I went back on coffee a couple months ago, because I really wanted to experience the benefits again, I had a few bumps with jitters but for the most part I start to tolerate it much better, until I started drinking it stronger and stronger and then had a big panic attack after a cup of strong coffee one day. I swore it off again, and now going through some crazy withdrawals. High cortisol in the mornings when I would normally have it. Maybe if I had slowed it down I wouldn't have got such a huge stress response and I'd be still be happily drinking it right now instead of going through hell.

 

[Peata]

My husband got me the Classic Gaggia for Christmas (Amazon.com: Gaggia 14101 Classic Espresso Machine, Brushed Stainless Steel: Kitchen & Dining).

It was a big deal for me, as espresso machines aren't cheap. But I love it and use it all the time. I average about 4 or 5 shots of espresso per day and it makes a beautiful frothy crema with the right grind of beans (although, I go and "ruin" it by putting cream in!). I'm not a super coffee snob, but my friends always comment on how good my coffee is when they come over (probably because I serve it with cream instead of milk) In the morning, I usually drink two shots (4 oz.) with two heaping teaspoons full of sugar and about 1/3 cup of half & half. I have at least 2 or 3 more shots with cream and sugar throughout the day, so 8 to 10 oz. total of espresso, which has about 500 mg of caffeine, 200 mg of magnesium, 12 mg of Niacin, and almost 0.5 mg of Riboflavin. I find it energizing and calming at the same time. Wakes my brain up without getting the jitters. Although, after listening to the more recent interview with RP on Danny Roddy's podcast, I think I will experiment with cold brew coffee too - for the antioxidants. Hope that helps!

Yes, thanks. I am tempted to get an espresso machine. You're right in praising espresso, there's something spectacular about it. I had a mocha (espresso with sweet milk chocolate) at a coffee shop and it elevated me. Though I brew coffee at home daily, it's when I have these quality coffees that I see the real fuss about coffee, and it's making me want to upgrade. The espresso tasted so good, and boosted my mood to the clouds. I wasn't jittery though. But my sinuses cleared up, I could breathe easier, and just felt amazing.

 

[Makrosky]

Background: 23y.o male.

I would like to share my experiences of being caffeine free for a week. This post is not to demonise coffee, nor to debate whether coffee is beneficial to health. It is simply to provide a perspective, to rationalise an addiction that I believe I know have in check.

The initial point of this experiment was to improve my sleep, which was terrible on all days of high caffeineted coffee consumption. I would have nights of lying awake until 2-3am on these days. This was even with the coffee consumption at latest 12 noon and would only be 2 cups of filtered coffee in terms of strength. I even tried every sleep concoction remedy possible to try to sleep- salt, sugar, aspirin, thyroid, magnesium. Nothing would put me to sleep on those days.

I also felt incredibly stressed every time i consumed it. I would be very jittery and worked up and would mistake this for euphoria. Looking back I feel the caffeine was covering up deeper issues i could not access in a stimulated state. I.E the true state of my body was not being revealed, but covered by the stimulant.

I also tried a couple of days of decaf coffee, and felt all the positives found below

Note: no other variables outside of Coffee Consumption have been made - it is the only factor changed in the last week that have harvested the results below:

Positives\
- Considerably less anxious. My stress levels have dramatically reduced. Nail picking, which i have been accustomed to for several years, has declined in accordance to this reduction in caffeine.
- Sleep - related to the above but a considerable change none the less. My sleep has improved two-fold and I have been able to fall asleep minutes upon lying down.
- Hunger us returning. I genuinely feel hungry at times of the day, which has been absent during my coffee drinking days
- Manic racing thoughts have subsided.
- Facial Hair Growth - I think this is androgen related. I am not sure whether this is due to the removal of caffeine, or that the above positives of better sleep and less stress (from reduced caffeine) has caused my facial hair growth to be thicker and quicker growing.

Negatives
- Water Retention, slight fat gain - I have been holding a lot more water so i believe it is more the former than the latter. This seems unrelated to salt consumption.
- Fatigue; my energy has dramatically dipped, but this is to be expected by reducing a stimulant.
- Caffeine Withdrawal phase - absolutely f****ng horrendous. No other words to describe it. Lasted three days - felt ill, faint and nauseous. I had an episode of light headiness which i nearly collapsed. But once this phase has passed, I feel a lot better and my energy is returning.
- Mood - has been a lot more negative; bordering on depression. I believe this is brain chemical related and the enhancing effects of coffee on the brain,
- Enjoyment - I love the taste of coffee, and is one of the few things I enjoy. Taking this away has been difficult and felt as if i am missing out on something that improves my mood.
Alcohol and Hungover - After a night of heavy drinking I have has the worst hangover in years. My alcohol consumption mirrors the levels i have had on previous nights and felt fine the next morning. I believe this could be liver related, and the reduction in liver cleansing via coffee has made my detoxification of alcohol more prominent and less effective. Perhaps my liver is functioning more poorly.



Thoughts/Takeaways
- Caffeine no doubt effects sleep. Some people remove caffeine from their system a lot quicker than others. Me being on the slow side. Caffeine simply lingers in my system far beyond 8 hours after drinking.
- Caffeine has pronounced effects on mood, energy and outlook.
- Coffee is brilliant for the liver and detoxification.
- Decaf Coffee can provide many of the benefits without those negatives of caffeine.
- You should always challenge the deeper underlying issue and not to try to cover up with supplements and stimulants.
- Coffee is and can be abused, and caffeine is ultimately a drug. It can do more harm than good.
- Caffeine should be consumed in relation to the health of the consumer. Just because one person can drink 6 cups withouts the negatives I experienced above, does not mean that others, myself included, can adopt the same approach.
- Its good to take a break and unwind.

I hope this helps all those who feel addicted to coffee, or feel obliged to drink it. Perhaps a better approach is to test and assess on your own body and see what works for you. For me, life without coffee has its ups and its downs.

Interesting reminder...thanks for sharing!!!

There's some interesting info users @Koveras and @tyw posted on this thread :
https://raypeatforum.com/community/...iciency-and-metabolic-rate-doubt.13342/page-4

Sidenote: the issue with xanthine oxidase is something that I see a lot of. Lots of times people complain that they can't handle coffee or chocolate. Give them molybdenum and manganese, and suddenly all issues go away.

Of course, this is just a management strategy, and the ideal solution is to fix the root cause of the issues. But it is a decently safe management strategy.

Also, I think there are good info on this thread :
Caffeine Reverses Stress, Insulin Resistance, Hypertension