Is It Worth Decreasing PUFA From 2 Grams to 1 Over Lifetime? Would It Matter?

[Clyde]

Is it worth switching from lentils to adzuki beans or coconut oil to MCT for example?

Would there be any actual benefit of reducing PUFA intake by 50% but by only 1gram over 90 years?

 

[EustaceBagge]

I think there is a much bigger benefit to not overthinking stuff like this. But to answer your question, based on my own experience, no. Depends on how much sfa you consume and how much vitamin E you have in your diet, how much damage you already did to your metabolism and how much fat stores you have in your body. General answer? Don't worry about it.

 

[Logan-]

I think there is a much bigger benefit to not overthinking stuff like this. But to answer your question, based on my own experience, no. Depends on how much sfa you consume and how much vitamin E you have in your diet, how much damage you already did to your metabolism and how much fat stores you have in your body. General answer? Don't worry about it.

This.

 

[Clyde]

I think there is a much bigger benefit to not overthinking stuff like this. But to answer your question, based on my own experience, no. Depends on how much sfa you consume and how much vitamin E you have in your diet, how much damage you already did to your metabolism and how much fat stores you have in your body. General answer? Don't worry about it.

Your right that it's not worth structuring your life around something like this but I still wonder whether theoretically it's valuable to have half as much PUFA stored in body fat. Or is there only value in not exceeding a threshold that most people would stay below on a natural diet.

So far nobody thinks it would matter. That's why I asked. I have no idea.

 

[peateats1]

Peat didn't like mct oil for some reason....I'm thinking he might have said it was irritating to the gut or something like that. I also agree with the others, that it probably is not worth stressing over reducing your pufa intake by that much. I think it's more important to just make sure you avoid consuming seed oils and other garbage.

 

[DKayJoe]

Peat didn't like mct oil for some reason....I'm thinking he might have said it was irritating to the gut or something like that. I also agree with the others, that it probably is not worth stressing over reducing your pufa intake by that much. I think it's more important to just make sure you avoid consuming seed oils and other garbage.

I recall he wrote it was quite fattening and not optimal but still far better than pufa, I think olive is pretty rich in squalene which is great for sexual health in men at least so it shouldn't be too detrimental to have some in the diet.

As for the op I think 4g daily is the important threshold to stay below as the body then doesn't accumulate it and starts to expell it from the fat stores. As long as you're expelling any excess that's not needed you should be fine, this takes years if coming from a pufa rich diet though which is pretty much everyone in a western country.

 

[frankmp0]

I recall he wrote it was quite fattening and not optimal but still far better than pufa, I think olive is pretty rich in squalene which is great for sexual health in men at least so it shouldn't be too detrimental to have some in the diet.

As for the op I think 4g daily is the important threshold to stay below as the body then doesn't accumulate it and starts to expell it from the fat stores. As long as you're expelling any excess that's not needed you should be fine, this takes years if coming from a pufa rich diet though which is pretty much everyone in a western country.

Isn't squalene pufa?

Also, wasn't it used as an adjuvant in the covax? implying it would be inflammatory.

 

[peateats1]

I recall he wrote it was quite fattening and not optimal but still far better than pufa, I think olive is pretty rich in squalene which is great for sexual health in men at least so it shouldn't be too detrimental to have some in the diet.

As for the op I think 4g daily is the important threshold to stay below as the body then doesn't accumulate it and starts to expell it from the fat stores. As long as you're expelling any excess that's not needed you should be fine, this takes years if coming from a pufa rich diet though which is pretty much everyone in a western country.

not to be annoying, but I remember him saying he wouldn't ingest it, he didn't trust it, it was irritating to the gut. stuff like that, not that it was fattening

 

[DKayJoe]

not to be annoying, but I remember him saying he wouldn't ingest it, he didn't trust it, it was irritating to the gut. stuff like that, not that it was fattening

Could you source it? Not disagreeing with you I'm just wondering when he said it, I believe I read the statement about it being fattening in the coconut oil article on his site. Would be nice to see if he said this after and maybe get to the bottom of why he wouldn't trust it.

 

[DKayJoe]

Isn't squalene pufa?

Also, wasn't it used as an adjuvant in the covax? implying it would be inflammatory.

You are correct, I meant to refer to squalane which is fully saturated, both are present in olive oil. I am unsure of squalenes use in the covax, I know there's been a fairly recent push in attaching lipids to medications etc in order to stabilise and prolong their effects within the cell but it wouldn't make sense for them not to use something unsaturated for this as it would destabilise cell structure I believe?

 

[peateats1]

Could you source it? Not disagreeing with you I'm just wondering when he said it, I believe I read the statement about it being fattening in the coconut oil article on his site. Would be nice to see if he said this after and maybe get to the bottom of why he wouldn't trust it.

This is what I probably read :
"Various fractions of coconut oil are coming into use as "drugs," meaning that they are advertised as treatments for diseases. Butyric acid is used to treat cancer, lauric and myristic acids to treat virus infections, and mixtures of medium-chain fats are sold for weight loss. Purification undoubtedly increases certain effects, and results in profitable products, but in the absence of more precise knowledge, I think the whole natural product, used as a regular food, is the best way to protect health. The shorter-chain fatty acids have strong, unpleasant odors; for a couple of days after I ate a small amount of a medium-chain triglyceride mixture, my skin oil emitted a rank, goaty smell. Some people don't seem to have that reaction, and the benefits might outweigh the stink, but these things just haven't been in use long enough to know whether they are safe. "

- Dr. Raymond Peat
Coconut Oil

 

[Highserotonin90]

@DKayJoe Is olive oil saturated?

 

[David PS]

It is nearly impossible to eat and keep your level of pufa at 1 or 2 grams per day. Enter your food at Cronometer.com and see how restrictive your diet would need to be. YOur would be setting yourself up for failure.

 

[Logan-]

It is nearly impossible to eat and keep your level of pufa at 1 or 2 grams per day. Enter your food at Cronometer.com and see how restrictive your diet would need to be. YOur would be setting yourself up for failure.

It would be extremely restrictive. Some lean meat, sugared fruit juice, starch, deodorised coconut oil, and maybe skimmed milk. This could still contain more than 1 or 2 grams of pufa though.

 

[Highserotonin90]

but if E is maintained at doses that guarantee the avoidance of peroxidation, particularly of PUFA (I still haven't understood what dosage we are talking about, perhaps in meals) could we worry less about their intake? I'm talking about the dosage of vitamin E in the meal.

 

[David PS]

It would be extremely restrictive. Some lean meat, sugared fruit juice, starch, deodorised coconut oil, and maybe skimmed milk. This could still contain more than 1 or 2 grams of pufa though.

I try to keep my pufa low but even coconut oil contains pufa. Dr. Peat used hydrogenated coconut oil.

There was a Russian study of using saturated peanut oil, very hard saturated fat shortening, and they found that it reversed the aging changes in mitochondria. Wow. And since that time, I've shifted to using hydrogenated coconut oil, which is now available on the internet. And that's okay? That's good? Very good, yeah, because it has zero PUFA. Okay. Is it actually hydrogenated or just kind of pure or virgin coconut oil, right? No, it's actually chemically hydrogenated. Oh, but that's okay.

19.01.24 Ray Peat on Thryroid and More

 

[Logan-]

I try to keep my pufa low but even coconut oil contains pufa. Dr. Peat used hydrogenated coconut oil.

By “deodorised” I meant hydrogenated. Same.

 

[David PS]

By “deodorised” I meant hydrogenated. Same.

I thought so but others might be confused.

edit: Another quote from Dr. Peat

Yeah, extra virgin oil has all of the aroma and good flavor, but it also has 2 or 3% of PUFA left in it. And it has some proteins, which for some people are allergenic. The hydrogenated has been not only thoroughly deodorized so there's no taste, but it has been treated so there's no PUFA left. So it's extremely, coconut oil itself is very stable against oxidation, but the hydrogenated form is essentially resistant. You just don't have the breakdown.

 

[DKayJoe]

@DKayJoe Is olive oil saturated?

14g per 100.

 

[Clyde]

This is what I probably read :
"Various fractions of coconut oil are coming into use as "drugs," meaning that they are advertised as treatments for diseases. Butyric acid is used to treat cancer, lauric and myristic acids to treat virus infections, and mixtures of medium-chain fats are sold for weight loss. Purification undoubtedly increases certain effects, and results in profitable products, but in the absence of more precise knowledge, I think the whole natural product, used as a regular food, is the best way to protect health. The shorter-chain fatty acids have strong, unpleasant odors; for a couple of days after I ate a small amount of a medium-chain triglyceride mixture, my skin oil emitted a rank, goaty smell. Some people don't seem to have that reaction, and the benefits might outweigh the stink, but these things just haven't been in use long enough to know whether they are safe. "

- Dr. Raymond Peat
Coconut Oil

He said in an interview with Roddy and Georgi that MCT oil could cause people to develop allergies. It was about a year ago so I'm not remembering the details.

And then Georgi started to squirm as Danny asked him whether he should dump half his products in the trash (more or less iirc:).